* fact display

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TMG_refugee
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fact display

Post by TMG_refugee » 30 Oct 2020 15:52

I have been working on trying to get all my data from Rootsmagic into an FH project. This process has not been easy and I have tried several workarounds to get the job done.

It seems that most custom facts and their related sentence structure do not migrate well so I have tried creating duplicate fact types in FH to mirror my fact types in RM and when importing FH seems to find my new fact types and imports them ok.

In the accompanying screen captures one fact type “Census-all” comes in and results in the highlighted representation under facts.
Facts-1.jpg
Facts-1.jpg (163.94 KiB) Viewed 556 times

This is the image of the fact definition.

Facts-2.jpg
Facts-2.jpg (89.04 KiB) Viewed 556 times

A second fact “criminal” was imported at the same time but resulted in a different representation under facts.

Facts-3.jpg
Facts-3.jpg (168.45 KiB) Viewed 556 times

I tried to include the image of the "criminal" fact definition as well but it seems to have exceeded the size limits.

My question is why are the displays different and have i created an error that I have not detected?

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LornaCraig
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Re: fact display

Post by LornaCraig » 30 Oct 2020 16:24

The displays are different because the census fact is an event and the criminal fact is an attribute. Attributes have a value, which events do not have, and the value is what is displayed in the facts tab.

I would suggest that the 'criminal' fact might be better defined as an event, as in "She commited a criminal offence on ...in..." and the details of incarceration could go in the Note field. Alternatively the incarceration could be the event, as in "She was incarcerated on.... in...." and the nature of the offence could go in the Note field.
Lorna

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TMG_refugee
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Re: fact display

Post by TMG_refugee » 30 Oct 2020 16:37

Lorna,

Thank you.

I have been working with my gedcom file and all these facts are exported from Rootsmagic as Even facts. Some are exported with an Even descriptor which gedcom 5.5.1 seems to contradict itself on based on an article by Tamura Jones.

Does the : reflect the fact that FH has imported an Even fact with a descriptor and if there is no Even descriptor it eliminates the : . It appears that the Even descriptor value is stored as a label value?

I understand that an even with a descriptor is regarded as an attribute in FH, which in this case it is not and the criminal offense was an event and not a long lasting attribute such as this person was Irish.

I don't think a discussion of GEDCOM and how it may be interpreted is my primary concern but how this will affect the way I can use those facts in FH?

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tatewise
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Re: fact display

Post by tatewise » 30 Oct 2020 18:32

The concept of Event and Attribute as two types of Fact is important in FH regardless of GEDCOM.

Events do NOT have a descriptor value, e.g. Birth and Census and Death.

Attributes do have a descriptor value, e.g. Occupation and Education and Religion.
( Take a look at their Sentence Templates. )

Custom events imported from TMG (EVEN without a descriptor) become EVEN in FH.
Custom attributes imported from TMG (EVEN with a descriptor) become _ATTR with a value in FH.

In the Sentence Template for an attribute such as Criminal you can have:
{individual} was a criminal {value} {date} {place}
i.e.
She was a criminal incarcerated for burglary for 10 years ...
She was a criminal held for $20,000 bond ...
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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TMG_refugee
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Re: fact display

Post by TMG_refugee » 30 Oct 2020 19:22

Mike

Thanks for your response. I have done some research pulling apart the various gedcom files and the FH project file and I see exactly what you are saying.

I will need to structure my input to at least be consistent so that FH predictably makes even or _attr facts.

Are there any FH downsides to having an event entered as an _attr rather than even?

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tatewise
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Re: fact display

Post by tatewise » 30 Oct 2020 19:42

No, there is fundamentally no difference between Events and Attributes (both Standard and Custom) other than Attributes have an optional descriptor value.
Conceptually, an Event only occurs at one point in time, whereas an Attribute applies over a period of time.
But if not concerned about such differences, Custom Attributes always have the advantage of the descriptor value.

WARNING:
If in TMG you have custom facts both with and without a descriptor then in FH you will get both Events and Attributes.
e.g.
If you have Criminal custom facts with a descriptor then they become Criminal custom attributes in FH.
If you also have Criminal custom facts without a descriptor then they become Criminal custom events in FH.
They will have two entries in Tools > Fact Types needing two Sentence Templates.
The Criminal custom events will NOT allow you to add a descriptor value.
The workaround is to use the Change Any Fact Tag plugin to convert all the Criminal events to attributes.

BTW: The reason FH does not allow custom events to have a descriptor value is that GEDCOM 5.5 does not allow EVEN tags to have a descriptor value, and FH prides itself on 100% compliance. Other products (such as TMG) are less strict and that leads to migration difficulties. So GEDCOM 5.5.1 introduced the custom FACT tag that allows a descriptor value and is equivalent to the FH _ATTR tag.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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TMG_refugee
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Re: fact display

Post by TMG_refugee » 30 Oct 2020 20:12

Mike thanks for the Plugin reference that will ease the import and conversion.

Both Rootsmagic and FamilyHistorian are due out with new versions- momentarily? There may be some hope there that I will have new versions insync

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