* What to call a person who is not a progenitor

The place to post news about genealogy products and services that might be of interest to other Family Historian users.
Post Reply
avatar
shoshk
Superstar
Posts: 280
Joined: 13 May 2015 16:28
Family Historian: V7
Location: Mitzpe Jericho, Israel

What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by shoshk »

Hi all,

My husband has been researching the Grimsby Jewish Community for years and years. Finally, he has agreed to start the analysis phase of the study and start publishing. Yay!

Among many other things, we are flagging people who were members of the community (born, resided, died or were buried in Grimsby) -- Grimbarians.

We are then flagging the Grimbarians as either

- Progenitors: individuals who do not have a Grimbarian ancestor
- Descendants: individuals who are descendants of a Progenitor
- Name TBD: individuals are do not have a Grimbarian ancestor who have no descendants (and therefore are not progenitors)

We've been going back and forth on what to call the third group. I'm currently calling them 'Non-Progenitors' in order to get on with the programming, but we don't like that. We've similarly rejected 'Loners', 'Strays', and 'Orphans'.

I thought I'd throw out the question here to see if anybody has a suggestion.

Thanks,
Shoshana
Shosh Kalson
User avatar
Jane
Site Admin
Posts: 8508
Joined: 01 Nov 2002 15:00
Family Historian: V7
Location: Somerset, England
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by Jane »

I would be tempted to call them "Strays"

It's a common term for people who turn up from outside the community for one or more events.

But as you don't like that one, you could simply use "incomer" "member" or similar
Jane
My Family History : My Photography "Knowledge is knowing that a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad."
avatar
shoshk
Superstar
Posts: 280
Joined: 13 May 2015 16:28
Family Historian: V7
Location: Mitzpe Jericho, Israel

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by shoshk »

Jane,

I, too, am inclined to call them 'Strays', but both my husband and daughter made a face when I suggested it. They both said it makes them think of stray animals.

But, if I get more votes for 'Strays' perhaps my husband will accept it. ;)

Regards,
Shosh
Shosh Kalson
User avatar
AdrianBruce
Megastar
Posts: 2090
Joined: 09 Aug 2003 21:02
Family Historian: V7
Location: South Cheshire
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by AdrianBruce »

Single-generation? Perhaps a bit longer than desired.
Adrian
User avatar
ColeValleyGirl
Megastar
Posts: 5465
Joined: 28 Dec 2005 22:02
Family Historian: V7
Location: Cirencester, Gloucestershire
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by ColeValleyGirl »

Tongue firmly in cheek: sojourner.
User avatar
LornaCraig
Megastar
Posts: 3190
Joined: 11 Jan 2005 17:36
Family Historian: V7
Location: Oxfordshire, UK

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by LornaCraig »

I'd vote for 'Loners', although I realise some of them might have been there with siblings so not strictly 'alone' in family terms.
Lorna
User avatar
mjashby
Megastar
Posts: 719
Joined: 23 Oct 2004 10:45
Family Historian: V7
Location: Yorkshire

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by mjashby »

A "Stranger" appears in many Parish Records indicating someone from an unknown place and/or of unknown origin.
avatar
shoshk
Superstar
Posts: 280
Joined: 13 May 2015 16:28
Family Historian: V7
Location: Mitzpe Jericho, Israel

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by shoshk »

I wanted to clarify a bit more, regarding the kinds of people that are included in this category.

1. People who appear as 'boarders' or 'servants' in the census for a household of known individuals.
2. People who were buried in the Jewish cemetery; may or may not have died in a Grimsby-associated registration district. Sometimes these are infants, so the parents were most probably Grimbarians, and of interest to us, but we have not yet been able to identify them.
Shosh Kalson
User avatar
ColeValleyGirl
Megastar
Posts: 5465
Joined: 28 Dec 2005 22:02
Family Historian: V7
Location: Cirencester, Gloucestershire
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by ColeValleyGirl »

You could use that useful catch-all: others.
User avatar
tatewise
Megastar
Posts: 28344
Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
Family Historian: V7
Location: Torbay, Devon, UK
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by tatewise »

I agree that 'Strays' sounds a bit derogatory, and does not really match your latest description.
'Others' is a good catch-all that has no unflattering meaning, or alternatively just 'Persons' or 'People'.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry
User avatar
davidf
Megastar
Posts: 951
Joined: 17 Jan 2009 19:14
Family Historian: V6.2
Location: UK

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by davidf »

Stand-alones?

Are you using "progenitor" with a specifically religious meaning? I struggled with your original question because a "progenitor" to me is any biologically related ancestor, whilst you seem to be trying to define a sort of "earliest identified Grimbarian" or "First Generation Grimbarian" (FGG).

You then have "subsequent generation Grimbarians" (SGG) - do you lose your Grimbarianishness if you are not born/resident/died/buried in Grimsby? Presumably Yes.

You then have 1st Generation Grimbarians who have not (yet) sprogged - Sprogless First Generation Grimbarians (SFGG)?

Or have I not understood the subtlety of your classification?
David
David
Running FH 6.2.7. Under Wine on Linux (Ubuntu 22.04 LTS + LXDE 11)
avatar
shoshk
Superstar
Posts: 280
Joined: 13 May 2015 16:28
Family Historian: V7
Location: Mitzpe Jericho, Israel

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by shoshk »

David,

Sprogless... LOL Since I'm not a Brit, I had to look that one up.

I like your suggestion of 'Stand-Alone'. It seems to me to be a neutral designation that captures our intention.

To clarify further, we are currently marking individuals, via a plugin, as follows:

- 'Grimbarian' (born, lived, died or buried in Grimsby), regardless of generation or religion; we use two flags to mark:
----- 'Progenitor' is the FGJG (First Generation Jewish Grimbarian)
----- 'Stand-Alone?' is a Sprogless First Generation Jewish Grimbarian (SFGJG)

- 'Ancestor' refers to non-Grimbarian ancestors of a 'Progenitor'

- 'Descendant' refers to non-Grimbarian descendants of a 'Progenitor'

- 'Married' refers to non-Grimbarians who married a 'Grimbarian'

- 'Married-Descendant' refers to non-Grimbarians who married a 'Descendant'

We are specifically marking the stand-alone Grimbarians because they are candidates for further research.

Many 'Stand-Alones' were buried in the Jewish cemetery. We assume that they had some familial connection to Grimsby (although there are isolated cases of burials when an individual died in or near Grimby and was buried there for practical reasons).

Other 'Stand-Alones' are people resident in a known Jewish household as 'boarders', 'servants', etc. We are currently making the assumption that they were Jewish (up to 1939, probably true). Again, there could be a familial connection to Grimsby.

I believe that we have covered at least the basic classifications.

Once we get this done, I'll be working on another plugin to generate all kinds of statistics.

I appreciate your input.

Regards,
Shosh
Shosh Kalson
avatar
NigelBrown
Diamond
Posts: 68
Joined: 27 Apr 2015 21:12
Family Historian: V6.2
Location: Wolverhampton, UK
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by NigelBrown »

What about "associates", having a similar meaning to the use of the term in FH.
Nigel Brown - https://vousden.one-name.net
Vousden One-Name Study - https://vousden.one-name.net
User avatar
tatewise
Megastar
Posts: 28344
Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
Family Historian: V7
Location: Torbay, Devon, UK
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by tatewise »

What about 'Resident' of Grimsby, as that is what they were (while they were alive).
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry
User avatar
ColeValleyGirl
Megastar
Posts: 5465
Joined: 28 Dec 2005 22:02
Family Historian: V7
Location: Cirencester, Gloucestershire
Contact:

Re: What to call a person who is not a progenitor

Post by ColeValleyGirl »

Mike, most of the people involved are residents, so it's accurate but not specific.

Has anyone suggested Unrelated yet (as in no known Grimbarian relatives identified yet)?
Post Reply