* Focus Window display of Spouses of children & siblings

[E Wilcock]

I am not an experienced user of FH and lack the vocabulary but I think this request applies to the Focus Window.

I would like the display list of children which is already in tabular form to include a column showing the fore and surname of the spouse of each child (if any).
Similarly the table of siblings on the Parents and sibling Tab should have a column to show the spouse name of each sibling.

I work extensively with cousin relationships - and the names of spouses are important in this context.

I currently use the discontinued software TMG which displays the spouse names of children and siblings. I need to see at a glance all the surnames connected to a particular person as these may explain business relationships or emigration destination. One sees the names of brothers and sisters in law of the person one is looking at.

TMG does not display the name of every spouse in cases where there are multiple marriages - however one spouse is better than nothing.

If the Focus Window could provide this insight, I would begin to make serious use of FH.

I have looked at the Preference for Focus window and cannot see a way of adding these names to either table.
I can read Spouse names on the Descendants Tab, but the spouses of children are scattered down a long list.

[Valkrider]

Can you do a screenshot of what it looks like in TMG? I am having problems understanding how this might look.

[tatewise]

I have moved this to the General Usage Forum until established that the Focus Window really does not show what you want. The New Wish List Requests Forum should only be a last resort.

I think the Descendants tab may give what you request, but it needs customising to make it easier to read when there are too many descendant generations.

Click the Customise View... link in top right corner of Focus Window pane.
Reduce the Descendant Generations (default) to the minimum of 2.
Now the Descendants tab only lists the Parents and their Children with all their Spouses.

When the Parents have married more than once, it also identifies which is the parent of each Child.

You can easily expand any Child branch by clicking the [+] icon, or follow that branch by clicking the Child's box. To go back just click the the white go back arrow near top left of pane.

[E Wilcock]

Colin,

I have uploaded and linked a screen shot of TMG as requested.

However it is not relevant as I am not asking for FH to change to resemble TMG.
I am expressing a wish for additional information - the names of spouses - to be shown on tabular lists that already exist in FH.

https://picasaweb.google.com/1165770291 ... 9606472450

[E Wilcock]

Mike - You have helped me a great deal in finding my way round FH. And it is your plug which has enabled me to carry my transferred data on my phone.

However there is a fine line between helping someone and exercising power - I am upset that my wish has been moved. I posted a wish and it should not have been censored.

FH is your programme, not mine. I have trespassed on your territory. And for some reason people get very defensive about it. But it isnt an aspect of FH that I feel comfortable with. Never have and never will. I suggest that you replace my wish on the wish list and delete this post of mine.

My suggestion (I repeat) is that an extra column with spouse names be added to tabular lists that already exist in FH. And it seems that from what I have tried with FH customisations and what people have said on TMG forums that they are not there at the moment.

It seemed to me sensible to come onto the FH wish list and place the request there.

[tatewise]

I am sorry I have upset you Evelyn, but a few points need to be clarified.

FH is NOT my program. I am just a user like you. This is the Family Historian User Group run voluntarily by users. It is completely independent of Calico Pie the FH vendors. See glossary:index|> Popular Topics for a full explanation of FH versus FHUG.

The policy for postings in the New Wish List Requests Forum is given in Please Read Before Posting Wishes (6176) and Calico Pie - Wish List Policy (6175), and your posting is still listed there, but it is not the best Forum to discuss possible existing features that might satisfy your wishes.

You admitted you were not an experienced user of FH. You also said you can read Spouse names on the Descendants Tab, but the spouses of children are scattered down a long list. So I assumed the Descendants tab might offer a satisfactory solution if the scattered long list could be compressed, and that is what I suggested.

If you are still unsatisfied with that as a workable solution then I am perfectly happy to reinstate the New Wish List Request. But remember that is just a FHUG wish list and several long-standing Wish List entries with very large votes have still not been implemented by Calico Pie. So it would also be advisable to contact them if you feel strongly about a missing feature.

[brianlummis]

Having been a user of TMG I can understand what Evelyn is looking for. However, I think that it is unlikely that it can be implemented easily in FH as there is a basic difference in the way that the two programs have been set up. The screen shot provided illustrates this, as the desktop in TMG could be configured by using different windows - the default being a Details window, equivalent to the Facts tab for Individual , a Children window similar to the to the Spouses and Children tab in the Focus Window but without the spouse, and a Siblings window similar to the Parents and Siblings tab in the Focus Window but without the parents.
As can be seen, it would take quite a major rearrangement of the program to achieve the same result due to FH using the more modern system of tabs against the older technology of windows and could be seen as a backward step. The only answer might be an additional "Custom" Tab which would allow you to select say Parents, Children and Siblings on the same tab.
For the time being, once you get used to clicking the correct tabs then all the information is available.

[E Wilcock]

Mike - I apologise. I did not understand that this forum is independent of the FH authors Calico Pie.

I have continued to use TMG and to postpone the moment when I need to put in the time mastering FH. Yet this question has continued to lurk at the back of my mind.

I do not want FH to slavishly mimic the screens offered in TMG. I posted the TMG screen shot only because I was asked to.

I do not fully understand the technical differences within FH or any other programme. But I noticed that a user can customise columns in some table shown in FH views.

I thought it should be possible for users to add a column to the Spouse and Children screen to show the spouses? And similarly on the Parents and siblings screen?

Is this impossible? And should I suggest it? I am still mystified as to why this cant remain in the suggestions Forum - but there you go.

I have databases (not family trees) in genealogical software where surnames of sibling spouses have some significance. For instance in the First World War, the sister of one man serving might be married to another in the same unit. And emigration destinations both in the 19th century and during the Nazi period were often determined through family marriage connections.

[tatewise]

Apology accepted.
It is quite a common misconception, and something of a compliment, that newcomers think the FHUG is run by Calico Pie when it is in fact run by volunteers.

It is true that many features of FH can be customised.

I suggested a way of customising the Descendants tab of the Focus Window to get close to what you requested. But unfortunately columns cannot be Customised there.

The Records Window and Queries could be Customised to list what you requested, but they are separate from the Focus Window. Also a Plugin could be written to list almost exactly what you requested, but again not in the Focus Window.

You say you do not want FH to slavishly mimic TMG, so are any of the above suggestions worth pursuing?
If not, then the Wish List Request can be reinstated, but do not expect a quick fix from Calico Pie.

BTW: Have you noticed that GedStar Pro has been updated to support more Gedcom facts, and the Export Gedcom File plugin now creates synthetic facts for all Witness Role facts. I tried to persuade the GedStar Pro author to support Gedcom Witnesses like TMG database imports but failed.

[E Wilcock]

I think the FH record list is a list of all the names? So it wouldnt help with identifying a family circle, unless one filtered it, and refiltered as one moved about the tree. And I dont yet understand queries.

I have though this evening and by chance come up with a screen that does indeed show the partners of both siblings and children. That is the Family Tree All Relatives screen - I reduced the magnification to 75% and could see the marriage partners of the siblings and the children of the person in the focus window.

I remember that when FH first came out, the revelation was that it offered a computer programme in which one could work directly from a Tree diagram, just like in the old days when our grandparents sketched out family trees.

Yet a few years later when I tried working with FH, I never looked at the tree view - one was doing data entry, attaching sources etc. The tree didnt seem to be a serious feature of the software.

I see it isnt that quick and easy, as one has to keep re-setting the magnification - but if one is spending an evening on one group, it is the best solution I have yet.

[tatewise]

Yes, tree Diagrams can display what you want, and maybe a Descendant Diagram with only 2 or 3 generations would be better than All Relatives, and scaling/zooming probably easier.

You are correct about the Records Window, but sorting on some custom columns may bring family groups together. Queries (and Plugins) provide exactly the filtering you mention, to produce a Result Set somewhat similar to the Records Window but for a family subset of data for whichever parents you choose. So for these kinds of data filtering you will find Queries worth exploring.

[jimlad68]

You might find that by changing the Diagram Options you do not need to reduce the magnification, then Diagram > save Diagram as > custom for future use.
In particular:
- general tab - generations, I use Orientation = Left-Right as I find that more space efficient and also "tabular" which was one of your requirements
- text tab - text scheme only what you need
- Dimensions tab + More dimensions
also no pictures or fancy boxes or lines

[E Wilcock]

A year later, I have not managed to display the surnames of spouses of siblings of an individual.

Nor to format the tree to show them legibly on a computer screen.

I really would like my user request to be registered that the surnames of the marriage partners of an individual's children and the marriage partners of their sibblings should be enabled as a column on the main screens.

These names and the relationships which they represent are highly significant in business dealings and in emigration and are often concealed.

E Wilcock

[jimlad68]

E,
EDIT - not sure if this will help, but might be a starting point.

If you use/add Alternate Names for individuals e.g. via the Main Tab > More(+) (say married name(s), change by deedpoll etc) for any relevant individuals these can be displayed in a query with expressions like %INDI.NAME[2]:SURNAME_FIRST%. I have attached the one I use. This can then be column sorted any way you want, or filtered with a condition etc.

[Mike Tate Comment: You can also use the Data Ref %INDI.~SPOU>NAME% for Spouse names in a Column of a Query or Records Window.]

[tatewise]

This is reply 1 of 3, where Ian MUNRO is the person of interest.

Would this Diagram satisfy your needs?
Ian MUNRO's sibling sisters and children are shown with all their spouses.
BTW: Customisations of this can show full-name on one line, make boxes smaller, alter colours, and font sizes, etc, etc.

Sibling and Children Spouse Names Diagram.png (11.86 KiB) Viewed 11372 times

If so then try importing the attached Diagram Type.

Select the Person of interest and then use View > Custom Diagram Types > Sibling & Children Spouse Names.

[tatewise]

This is reply 2 of 3, where Ian MUNRO is the person of interest.

Alternatively, would this Query list the necessary details?
Only the 1st Spouse of each person is listed, but others could be added.

Sibling and Children Spouse Names Query.png (10.18 KiB) Viewed 11372 times

If so then try importing the attached Query.

Use View > Custom Queries > Sibling & Children Spouse Names and select the Person of interest.

[tatewise]

This is reply 3 of 3, where Ian MUNRO is the person of interest.

In the Focus Window make the Person of interest the Focus and select the Descendants tab.
Click Customize View top right of Focus pane and ensure Descendant Generations (default) is 2.
Click OK and the tab should list the Person and Children with all their Spouses.

Sibling and Children Spouse Names Descendant tab.png (6.53 KiB) Viewed 11363 times

To obtain the Person's Siblings and Spouses ensure the Person's Property Box is shown alongside.
Click large blue Up arrow to open Parent window and click adjacent magnifying glass icon to make Focus.
Select the Descendants tab to show Parents and Siblings of Person of interest with all their Spouses.

[E Wilcock]

Thank you I will take time to look at all of these suggestions and downloads.

However, my original request was for this to go on the wish list. That was turned down by FHUG, The thread was moved here. I would like it to go in the requests.
I know I can get the information by moving from the focus person to the parents and looking at their descendants. That is two clicks.

[ColeValleyGirl]

Yes, that was the original request but please first follow the usual process of exhausting all options with the software as it currently exists. Once that has been done, a wish list request can be added to the existing 174 requests and voted on.

[tatewise]

If you can obtain the details you need in two clicks, then even if we added your request to the Wish List it is unlikely that Calico Pie would implement it, since FH already shows the details you want quite efficiently, so there would be little commercial gain in return for their effort.

Many FHUG users would rather focus the attention of Calico Pie on some long-standing high Vote wishes, than dilute it with requests that add little functionality.

[E Wilcock]

First, I am not totally sure that I can. Not using the FH sample data base.
Just as one might be be to edit the tree view - say if one could set it left to right and have the spouses appear alongside their partners as in a list.
I have from the start found it really hard that the FH software relies on Help from users who are independent of Calico Pie .It is not a neutral place but a defensive strong hold.
I am rebuked that most users dont want this and my wanting it might somehow be detrimental to their requests?

I do not understand why it is so impossible to add a further column to the windows for siblings to show the names of their spouses. Nor why one cant request it.
The answers on this thread seem more intent on pointing out that TMG screens do not show all marriage partners and thus fall short of what reputable software like FH might provide.

[tatewise]

Regarding the two clicks, I was only quoting your own posting that implied you could obtain what you wanted in two clicks:
"I know I can get the information by moving from the focus person to the parents and looking at their descendants. That is two clicks."

I do not understand the point of your comment: "Not using the FH sample data base". How is that relevant?

I am not sure that FH relies on help from a user group any more than other software products. Most of the advice we offer is available in the FH Help pages, allied with a little experimentation, but some users prefer taking the shortcut of asking here.

We like to explore the existing options within FH to see if they will satisfy your request, because that way you get a solution that works today, rather than wait indefinitely for Calico Pie to implement a new feature. But you seem opposed to this approach, so I have added Wish List Ref 554 Spouse details for Children in Focus Window that you can Vote for and hope that Calico Pie implement it one day.

There has been no comparison with TMG screens in any of the postings. I simply indicated for your information where the attached examples did or did not show all spouses, just in case it mattered to you, and for the benefit of others following this thread. It was not meant as any criticism of TMG.

Regarding showing a list of Siblings and Children with Spouses, that is offered by the Query posted earlier as reply 2 of 3.
Did you try that attachment?

Also a Diagram can be more like a list as illustrated by attached Diagram Type. Other customisations are possible.

Sibling and Children Spouse Surnames Diagram.png (11.55 KiB) Viewed 11246 times

[jimlad68]

E, you are right to want more from your software. But at least for the present FH is going forward with each release, unlike a lot of software these days that loses features when it changes platform or dumbs down for mobile devices!

Despite the international popularity of genealogy, for some reason the desktop software does not sell that many copies, (even FTM with all of Ancestry's resources and sales could not keep going), so that means fewer resources and an effective competition field of about 4 main vendors.

I think many would rather see the resources of Calico Pie go towards important features that are completely missing rather than fine tuning the current program. Some might disagree and prefer fine tunings and easier usability of the existing.

Buy hey, one thing I have learnt over many years in IT, is that some requests that appear very difficult can be very easy implement, while the reverse is also true.

So please keep the complaints/ frustrations/ questions coming. There might be an existing method, or a workaround to be had, and for the longer term add to the wish list. Many people, myself included, greatly appreciate the queries from other users; we learn a lot from the answers and even get fixes for problems we never knew we had!

[Jane]

One thing which is worth remembering with FH which is not true for most other programs is that you can have the Property box open with almost every Workspace window. So you can have the Property box open with a query result set and edit information that way and of course the same is true of the diagram window, in fact many long time users work almost exclusively in the diagram or Records window and seldom go to the Focus window.

[AnneEast]

That describes me, Jane. I never, ever use the focus window! I much prefer to use the property box floating over the record list or a diagram.
Anne