* Showing Source Citation Media Filenames in Queries

[Little.auk]

Having used AS for BMD sources I am now starting to use it to generate census sources from media downloaded from Find My Past. Although the AS aspect is not really relevant to my questions.

For each persons census record FTM FMP provides three related data sets. The first two are - a) an Image of the original census page and b) a transcript of the relevant Household record. These are the same for every person in the Household, so I link both of them to the source in AS, and then save the AS source to FH, which links the source to all the people in the household ( for some of my ancestral families this is 10 or more people!).

The third FTM FMP image is a "Person specific" transcript for each individual in the household. I suppose that the "correct" way to deal with these would be to create separate sources for each, but that would be a lot of work. I have found that an easier way is to link each person's transcript to the source in FH using the "Add to Citation" option, which links only to that person.

Two questions on this approach - first, is this likely to create any unforeseen problems, and second, what is the syntax for showing these citation records in queries?

[tatewise]

Peter, you mentioned FindMyPast initially and then referred to FTM which I presume is a typo for FMP.

I would expect the third person specific transcript is just a repeated extract from the second household transcript.
So I suspect it does not add any useful information.
Usually, with the Method 1 splitter mode of Source Citations you are using, the household transcript and image in the Source record are sufficient evidence and the Citation-specific details are left blank.
That is the way the AS Census Grid for the household will insert the transcript into the Source record Text From Source.

That is the recommended method and if you follow that via AS and FH then there is no need to show those Citations in Queries.

[NickWalker]

Hi Peter

Just to expand a little on what Mike has said. When you fill in the census grid in AS and then click the 'Auto' button, AS will generate a source text transcription of the data entered into the grid. This almost always then needs to be edited a little to make a more accurate transcription. For example, you may have correctly recorded an occupation as Agricultural Labourer in the grid (as this gets copied into an occupation fact) but in the original image it may be recorded as Ag Lab so you could edit the source text to reflect this. This transcription is likely to be far more accurate than the transcript in FMP or Ancestry and will include columns that they don't transcribe. So there is no benefit to copying that data over.

If you've not seen it, you may find my AS introduction video helpful as I demonstrate how I would record a census source.

[ADC65]

I would reinforce what Nick has said, in that the transcript screens on FMP are not to be trusted and I would seriously think about whether to use them in your FH research. Occupations are notoriously inaccurate, but address and especially house names are often guesswork. Less common, but still not rare, are mis-transcriptions of enumeration districts, etc.

I would suggest using AS to create your own text transcript as Nick explains. Once you have the hang of it, it is simple to do and in my opinion produces far better results.

Mike is also correct in saying that the third screen, of individual data, is just a different view of the transcript screen and adds no extra data.

[Little.auk]

Peter, you mentioned FindMyPast initially and then referred to FTM which I presume is a typo for FMP.

Quite right! I have amended my post!

I would expect the third person specific transcript is just a repeated extract from the second household transcript.
So I suspect it does not add any useful information.

Despite other responders suggesting the same thing , that is not true. The individual's census transcript contains the census record reference details (Class, Piece, Folio, Page, etc.) which does not appear in the "Household" transcript.

In most cases this reference is identical for the whole household, but I do have some Census records where households span two pages, some members appearing, for example, on page 16 and others on page 17 of the census! The "Household" transcript shows the whole household but does not indicate this spans two census pages. The "Individual " Transcripts do record the correct page numbers.

I am using the expression %INDI.CENS[year=1841].SOUR[1]>OBJE[1]>FILE[1].TITL% to list source media titles in FH queries, how do I need to modify this to show the same for "citation" media files?

[NickWalker]

A census reference isn't a transcription though, you just need to type or paste that into the Reference ID field in AS and it will be recorded in the Publication Information field of the source if you use the default method 1 settings. There is an option to record it in the 'Where in Source' field in each citation if you wish.

I think generally most people would just record the reference for the page that the census entry starts on rather than bothering to add a reference for each individual person.

[tatewise]

The individual's census transcript contains the census record reference details (Class, Piece, Folio, Page, etc.) which does not appear in the "Household" transcript.

In most cases this reference is identical for the whole household, but I do have some Census records where households span two pages, some members appearing, for example, on page 16 and others on page 17 of the census! The "Household" transcript shows the whole household but does not indicate this spans two census pages. The "Individual " Transcripts do record the correct page numbers.

I am using the expression %INDI.CENS[year=1841].SOUR[1]>OBJE[1]>FILE[1].TITL% to list source media titles in FH queries, how do I need to modify this to show the same for "citation" media files?

Where the reference details (Class, Piece, Folio, Page, etc.) appear in online transcripts varies from website to website.
As others have said, do not rely on such online transcripts. Recreate them from the Media image, etc, (using AS).
In the rare cases where a household spans 2 or more pages then record that as for example Page 16-17 in the Source record and attach both/all Media records for the page images, i.e. as Nick has said.
The Method 1 'splitter' objective is to capture all the necessary details in one Source record leaving the Citations empty.

%INDI.CENS[year=1841].SOUR[1].OBJE[1]>FILE[1].TITL% will list citation media titles.
But to reiterate, this should not be needed if you follow the advice given here.

[Little.auk]

%INDI.CENS[year=1841].SOUR[1].OBJE[1]>FILE[1].TITL% will list citation media titles.

Actually, it doesn't! It lists the "Source" linked media (using OBJE(1), OBJE(2) etc.) but doesn't find media linked to a citation. The image below shows the "Source " media as items 1 and 2 and the "Citation media as item 1 with the citation field ticked. the second screenshot shows how these files are configured in the Individual Record.

Note - the first listed media record is the citation record, the following two are the source record.

Screenshot 2023-03-01 094613.jpg (64.39 KiB) Viewed 481 times

I started my family history research in the last century, pre- Ancestry, FreeBMD and other online facilities and I apply Genealogical Proof standards to all my findings. I am well aware of the unreliability of transcripts. The reason I am using these transcript images is for inclusion in a "website" family tree I am creating, on a flash drive, for my sisters 75th birthday present. Totally outside of FH - but I am using FH queries to help track my "website" build progress, hence my question.

[tatewise]

Peter, that data reference works for me.
Have you noticed that there is a dot (.) not a greaterthan (>) between SOUR[1] and OBJE[1]?
%INDI.CENS[year=1841].SOUR[1].OBJE[1]>FILE[1].TITL%

That . means use the subsidiary OBJE tag local to the Citation. Just like the ones between the other tags.
Whereas > means follow the SOUR link to the Source record to find the OBJE tag, which is what your original data reference does.

[Little.auk]

Thanks Mike,

I hadn't noticed the switch to dot. It is working for me too now.