* Identifying several individuals from one source

[phende]

I have just moved to V7 and am slowly learning where to find things. ( Confession: I started on V3 and still prefer to work from the Records window, hardly ever using the Focus window.) This post chronicles how I have misunderstood at least one new feature.
I decided to have a go at Source Driven Data Entry and thought I had an ideal example. In 1868, a fishing boat foundered off North Shields with the loss of all crew. Five of these men are in my tree and I have always had difficulty remembering who they were. I had newspaper report(s) giving their names so I had added these to the Death record for each man, but did not create a Source. This meant I had to read the report each time I wanted to remind myself who the crew members were. (In V7, I can now create hyperlinks to each crew member in the Note field of the Death event. This is great, but I do have to copy these links to each crew member, deleting the one that links to himself.)
I then asked myself if this is not a prime candidate for Source Driven Data Entry, so I created a new Source, using the Newspaper template. This allows me to identify the newspaper and the publication date (instead of specifying these in the Media dialogue) and mark the source as Secondary evidence. I then expected to be able to create a Citation for the source in the death event for each individual before I realised this is not how it works. The system only allows you to create Events identified in the source using a Data Entry Assistant but these DEAs are written for specific events (BMD and census, mainly) and are not (cannot be?) designed for Newspaper reports.
Having created the source, I have been able to add a Citation to each death and, by looking at the source, I can see what records are linked to it. This is an improvement to my previous implementation, and perhaps makes the hyperlinks redundant, but it was a bit of a hassle. Can anyone suggest a better way to deal with matters like this?

Peter

[Jane]

My normal method for this is to use the prepared citation window to set up the source and then turn on automatic citation to add the facts as needed manually. With automatic citation turned on this will add the citation to each new fact, or you can copy and paste the citation to each fact in the normal way.

[phende]

Thanks, Jane. I did switch on Automatic Source Citation (which I have not used up to now) but that does not help as there is no DEA for newspapers. I had expected to see a dialogue something like AS, where there is a list of individuals. Select an individual and display the Events and attach a citation to the death. I was reading too much into the puff in favour of SDDE.
Once I had created the source, it wasn’t difficult to put a citation in each death event as the source was then the last in the list, but your suggestion of copy and paste is clearly better.

Peter

[tatewise]

Peter, Automatic Source Citations (ASC) and Data Entry Assistants (DEA) are two independent techniques that support Source Driven Data Entry (SDDE). In this instance, you cannot use SDDE but need retrospective Source Citation entry.

With SDDE you start by preparing the Source Citation details and then use ASC or DEA to create the Facts and automatically link the Citations. Ancestral Sources supports a similar approach for capturing new Source material.

Ancestral Sources does also allow some types of Sources to be added retrospectively to some types of existing Facts.

So the technique you used to manually add the Citations to the existing Death Events is the way to go.

[phende]

Thanks, Mike. Light is slowly creeping over the horizon. I am still at the stage of not really seeing the difference between Source Driven and Event Driven Data Entry. Whereas I thought that one piece of media could act as the source for several events, that piece of media is actually the starting point of several sources or events. As another example, in Scotland, where the statutory BMD records are much superior to the rest of the UK, when you download a page from Scotland’s People you get three births or deaths, or two marriages. I had thought this page was a Source but it’s not. It gives you multiple sources or events, each sharing the same piece of media. Whether you then use SDDE or EDDE depends on what’s available and, currently, there is a paucity of DDEs, none of them catering for Scottish records. I’m sticking with AS.

Peter

[NickWalker]

Thanks, Mike. Light is slowly creeping over the horizon. I am still at the stage of not really seeing the difference between Source Driven and Event Driven Data Entry. Whereas I thought that one piece of media could act as the source for several events, that piece of media is actually the starting point of several sources or events. As another example, in Scotland, where the statutory BMD records are much superior to the rest of the UK, when you download a page from Scotland’s People you get three births or deaths, or two marriages. I had thought this page was a Source but it’s not. It gives you multiple sources or events, each sharing the same piece of media. Whether you then use SDDE or EDDE depends on what’s available and, currently, there is a paucity of DDEs, none of them catering for Scottish records. I’m sticking with AS.

Peter

I think Ancestral Sources does use (and pioneered) a source driven approach. You are entering in the details of the source record and from that the various facts, etc. are generated. However, AS can only cater for the standard sources namely census (and census-like documents), birth certificates, baptisms, marriages, death certificates and burials. If I have a letter or perhaps a family bible that refers to the birth and death dates of various individuals then AS doesn't have a mode to record that kind of thing. In that case in FH I'd create a source for the letter first and transcribe the letter (or the key points) and I'd link an image of the letter to it. Then I'd turn on the Automatic Source Citation and add the facts one by one. I'd argue this is still source driven, it just isn't being done automagically for me.

[tatewise]

I am still at the stage of not really seeing the difference between Source Driven and Event Driven Data Entry. Whereas I thought that one piece of media could act as the source for several events, that piece of media is actually the starting point of several sources or events. As another example, in Scotland, where the statutory BMD records are much superior to the rest of the UK, when you download a page from Scotland’s People you get three births or deaths, or two marriages. I had thought this page was a Source but it’s not.

With Source Driven Data Entry you first create a Source record and prepare a Citation, and afterwards you create the Facts (Events & Attributes) to which a Citation is automatically attached. AS, DEA & ASC focus on this process.
With Event Driven Data Entry you first create the Facts (Events & Attributes) and afterwards create the Source Citations that are linked to the Facts. AS and ASC offer this option under some circumstances.

Users choose how the Source Media is associated with Source Records in various ways:

• The typical Method 2 'lumper' approach would treat the entire set of say Scotland Birth records as one Source Record with the Media pages attached to the Citations.
• Some users do treat a page of Media as one Source despite holding several Birth or Death or Census details.
• The typical Method 1 'splitter' approach would treat one person's Birth or Death record or one Census household as a separate Source Record and may need the Media image to be cropped or the Link to Detail frame applied.

[phende]

Many thanks for these inputs, particularly from Nick, pointing out that I have been using Source Driven Data Input for years. Reviewing my past practice, I have used AS for censuses, creating birth records along the way, but tend to be a lumper for BMDs with references to the record in the Where within Source field and attaching a media record if available. I clearly need to learn to use ASC.