* dies after 1911 cant find not on 1939 Census

[Gowermick]

... I know you can specify birth place, but search result screen doesn’t usually show them, only where the people were living. ...

1911 Census results do show the birth place. Quite what the 1921 search results will show is not known to me yet...

Adrian,
Sorry to disagree, but FMP search results for 1911 only show residence NOT place of birth.
For exeample, My grandfather who was born on Bromley, Middlesex, is listed as Limehouse, Middlesex, which is wherehe was living at the time. It is only when you look at the transcription can you see his birth place!

[davidf]

I tend to agree with you David, so replace the %INDI.CENS[last].DATE% filter with:
Exclude if %INDI.BIRT[1].DATE% was earlier than 1820

Still learning, so this may be missing something.
If you replace the last census date with the suggested birthdate filter, wouldn't that return everyone born after 1820 - not just those in England?
thanks - Brian

Brian
Yes, you are correct - Queries often need refining to do exactly what you want and you usually have to accept a compromise.

However sticking with last census date = 1911 will also return those who completed the 1911 census and then went abroad, but not return those were abroad in 1911 and either returned or migrated in before 1921. It would also give confusing results for anyone who completed a non-GB&I census in 1911!

If you are wanting in this case a "work to list" for the 1921 census, you need to consider how "perfect" you want the list. With an internationally diverse family tree, you are probably right in your suspicion that sticking with last census = 1911 is best.

If you do however have an internationally diverse tree, you probably need some strategy for handling the fact that different subsets fall within the scope of different sources - the 1921 census being a prime example. Creating a query that can reliably exclude those who were not in the country is not easy - as almost by definition without the 1921 census, you don't know who was in the country in 1921!

Those of interest to me who migrated are a very small number - and once migrated they tended not to come back. So for me I keep separate projects for different jurisdictions and manage the fact that migrants can appear in multiple projects. (Some strongly disapprove of multiple projects; FH can handle massive projects - it's me that struggles!)

[tatewise]

For greater control over which people are candidates for any particular census, then use the Lookup Missing Census Facts plugin that already 'knows' about the UK 1921 Census. It takes account of emigration and immigration facts, name changes due to marriage, and of course birth, baptism, christening, death, burial, cremation and census events.

Victor, the 1939 Register is unique, but for the purposes of data analysis, it is best treated as a Census Event.
It has the hallmarks of a census, was based on the planned 1941 Census, and is categorised as a Census in FindMyPast.
If it is not recorded as a Census Event then many FH features won't recognise it. See Recording from a Census Record.

[AdrianBruce]

... Sorry to disagree, but FMP search results for 1911 only show residence NOT place of birth. ...

1911 search results.jpg (74.57 KiB) Viewed 1422 times

Please see above! There is of course the "minor" detail that great-granddad Simeon wrote "Haslington" as a birthplace once for the entire family against great-granny - so only she has a birthplace on the form.

Of course, there is this trap that even I fall into of not going to the precise collection and just searching from "Census" when you see this:

Screenshot 2021-11-01 all census.jpg (77.51 KiB) Viewed 1422 times

And on this one, nothing has a birthplace - presumably because the collection name is there instead. Also the location details on the generic form and explicit 1911 form are different - both Registration District and Parish appear separately on the 1911 - not sure what the generic results show.

So the lesson will definitely be - use the explicit 1921 collection search screen when it appears, not the generic one.

[Gowermick]

Adrian,
Humble pie time.

Of course, I was using generic search!
Lesson learned

[tatewise]

Adrian is absolutely correct.
If you use a 'generic' collection you get the filters and lists for the least detailed member of the collection.
To get the best search results choose a specific collection, such as for a specific census in a specific year in a specific region.

Rather than starting from the 'Search' droplist entry 'Census, land & surveys', I prefer the 'All Record Sets' option.
Then enter 'census' in the top filter and select perhaps 'England' in the Where filter below.
The list of record sets on the right provides a comprehensive choice to select.
( Victor, note the 1939 Register is listed here with Subcategory: Census and not Electoral Roll )

[AdrianBruce]

... I was using generic search! ...

Yes, for all that I wrote above, I confess that I often try to wing it and use the generic search. That's actually why I prefer to use Ancestry for census searches over the years. If I'm looking in the England & Wales censuses for (say) GGF Simeon Cooper born about YYYY, I can see the different Simeons, with all their birthplaces and residences, all in one go so I can see that there's (say) only 2 born in Cheshire in each census, helping me to decide how the various records go together. But Ancestry seem to arrange the census data in a stack of vertical cards, rather than 1 line per person, allowing them to get more in.

[AdrianBruce]

1911 Census results do show the birth place. Quite what the 1921 search results will show is not known to me yet...

Adrian, you must get your crystal ball serviced...

Your wish is my command... I subbed an enquiry to FMP asking them to "please confirm the layout of the search results screen (not the transcript)". Their response today includes:

All users will have access to both simple and more advanced search fields for 1921 records - meaning you can search not only on names & locations, but also on other household members, occupations and other biographical details captured in the census forms.

Results pages will show (with no charge) names, birth year & birthplace and parish & registration district in the census records. And a preview hover-over will also indicate the names of a couple of other members of the same household.

So this would reiterate that one should use the seach form for that 1921 collection, not the generic census search.

[fhtess65]

Preparation is definitely key...I blogged about just this on Sunday. It's really no different than a lot of the genealogy work we already do. Good to know that those search results will help people narrow down the possibilities - especially the names of at least one or two others in the household.

Your wish is my command... I subbed an enquiry to FMP asking them to "please confirm the layout of the search results screen (not the transcript)". Their response today includes:

All users will have access to both simple and more advanced search fields for 1921 records - meaning you can search not only on names & locations, but also on other household members, occupations and other biographical details captured in the census forms.

Results pages will show (with no charge) names, birth year & birthplace and parish & registration district in the census records. And a preview hover-over will also indicate the names of a couple of other members of the same household.

So this would reiterate that one should use the seach form for that 1921 collection, not the generic census search.