* Searching the FHUG site

[jimlad68]

Searching the forum.

I've noticed when searching the forum that if you want to use a common item you get the message:

The following words in your search query were ignored because they are too common words: windows 10.
You must specify at least one word to search for. Each word must consist of at least 3 characters and must not contain more than 14 characters excluding wildcards.

Neither does it allow phrases. e.g. "windows 10"

What it also means is that if you want to search for windows 10 fact, it ignores windows 10 and just searches fact, and even a "search these results" will ignore the common words.

I take it that this is the limitation of the forum software.

Is there a way to search on common terms, which of course might not be common when with other terms or in a phrase?

My workaround which although not displaying the results as clearly as from the forum, works quite well for me. I just use a google site search e.g.

"windows 10" 2015 site:www.fhug.org.uk

You also have the power of all the other google search options.

I can see that the a drawback could be how well google "scrapes" (I think that is the term) the FHUG website for detail, and whether google returns ALL results.
I came across this page recently which I found very comprehensive but easy to read, but I'm sure there are many similar sites:
http://www.googleguide.com/category/overview/index.html (I don't think is is completely up to date, but which site is re the ever changing google products)

Has anyone else any other workarounds?

[ColeValleyGirl]

I've moved this to the forum for discussing how this site works.

[Keithj]

Now here's a curious thing:

I just did a search for "Windows 10 fact" and it found the above post and highlighted all three words:



It said it was ignoring Windows 10, but as you see it didn't!

I administer some phpBB sites elsewhere and have not come across any problems with the search facility there. There are some admin-adjustable options, which are needed in some places, but apart from that it's well behaved.

Are you sure it was the site rather than your browser that was misbehaving? I ran the above search on a Win 7 HP (up to date) machine using Firefox.

[jimlad68]

Curiouser and curiouser:

If I search on Windows 10 fact (even without the quotes) I get ignored: windows 10, but get lots of hits, but most of them do not include windows 10, I think it pics up the items it does because fact is also in the text and in this case because windows was in the same post as fact.

Ironically, I would have thought that fact was more common than windows, perhaps there are some settings somewhere.

So, as with many search programs (especially of large databases) the results can be inconsistent. I did a web search on google search and when it says it has found x,000000 items, it will only show you a fraction of them, speed and what "THEY" think you are interested in is what matters, hence, although I like google search, I also like to use other search engines like https://millionshort.com/index.html to drill down and exclude dominating sites.

[Jane]

The settings are as follows, I could raise the percentage for common words, so Windows gets indexed, and drop the index of words down to index words of 2 characters, but that would not sort out for example windows 8 or windows 7.

2015-07-27_081936.png (27.13 KiB) Viewed 10860 times

[jimlad68]

Yes, always a balance, for me what you suggest would be better but possibly not for others. Ideally it would be nice to choose on the advanced search page, but I suspect pre indexing is required. I do feel the common word threshold could be reduced completely as often it is a combination of common words that is needed, my chance example of "fact" for instance. The lack of phrase search does not help.

However, for me, I now find the google site search very useful with all its options. So don't waste too much time on my behalf.

[jimlad68]

P.S. on reflection I suppose the search facility is a key feature in that it can make finding solutions to problems a lot easier and hence fewer "repeated" questions.

While on the subject of Forum usage, I find the * "Click for Topic Link Code" very useful, is there a similar one for the Knowledge Base?

Just a thought,
- would it be helpful to add a few more "hints and wrinkles" to the FAQ or KB for info:forums&s|Forums Usage Tips, things like the * "Click for Topic Link Code" as in:

I have added a small extra function. If you look at the Topic Title you will see an * to the left of it, if you click on it you will get a filled in Topic link you can paste into another post with out having to make a note of the number and title.
Forum Usage Guide (4252)

and even the google site search I detailed above. The links in the info:forums&s|Forums Usage Tips are good but I don't think include some FHUG features.

- also add to the top of the FAQ the info:forums&s|Forums Usage Tips or even a separate button at the top of the forum page.

[Jane]

I have added a "*" for the Knowledge base on the end of the Breadcrumbs at the top of the page.

Don't forget you can update the pages on the Wiki so if you think there is something missing you can add it.

[tatewise]

That is great Jane, but could you insert a > and space after the vertical bar, otherwise Knowledge Base runs into the page title, also the popup box should say hit CTRL-C to copy the KB shortcut.
e.g. Instead of how_to:index|Family Historian I would prefer how_to:index|> Family Historian

I will update the info:forums|> Forums Usage Tips to describe this new feature.

Regarding the search Common word threshold setting, I am surprised that Windows occurs in more than 50% of postings!

[jimlad68]

Great. I had better put my money where my mouth is now, but it will take a few days. I trust it will be moderated/checked, for accuracy and readability. So now to "Signing Up For Editing"

[tatewise]

Yes Jim, the KB pages are moderated, and if necessary can be rolled back to an earlier version on a page by page basis.

[Jane]

I have re-formatted the copy option. I suspect the search index needs rebuilding for "windows" so I'll kick that off next weekend as I suspect it's going to take a long time to rebuild it currently has several million records in it.

[tatewise]

Jim, I note your useful updates to the info:forums|> Forums Usage Tips page regarding Google Site Search.

You say "The downside is that the format of the results will not be as well formatted." but I have not experienced that. When the chosen page in Google is opened it is formatted absolutely as it would be in FHUG. Perhaps it is that the example you give of "change any fact" -usage site:www.fhug.org.uk unfortunately only finds Plugin Help & Advice pages that do NOT have the usual Knowledge Base navigation sidebars, etc, but that is normal. Any standard Knowledge Base or Forum pages display OK.

Perhaps changes to the example are needed?
Maybe one example focussed on www.fhug.org.uk/forum/ and another on www.fhug.org.uk/wiki/?

I often use examples that associate with the KB page itself, so an example that finds this posting, and one that finds the Forums Usage Tips page.

[jimlad68]

"The downside is that the format of the results will not be as well formatted." This relates to the results

Will update and reword to make that clearer and also the split between forum and wiki + the existing example for Both.

[jimlad68]

Updated, and then again to add:

## EDITED 20150729:2020 to clarify/correct the double quote usage ##

To make it quicker to access you could perform a Google Site Search and then bookmark it, then in future just amend the search term. You may find the format below of the search quicker to use with a bookmark. You probably don't need the double quotes at the end, but this will save an extra blank keystroke and also make it ready for a phrase search; having clicked on your bookmark it will return all results for the site, you can then add your search criteria directly after the "", or use the "" for a phrase search.

site:www.fhug.org.uk ""

Please feel free to update.