* Using GEDSTAR Pro with FH import from TMG

[tatewise]

I totally agree with Don, but Evelyn not only had that inexplicable problem with TMG, but also had the 'freezing' problem with FH Plugins, so I wonder if the problem lies elsewhere; some configuration problem with the PC perhaps?

[E Wilcock]

Don - I have been doing all experimental alterations in TMG prior to the transfer. And today at last, I have identified my user error there - it was in editing the Tags / Events and is sorted now.

I am very grateful for the information and opinions in this thread.

Someone expert in GEDCOM may be able to investigate further a GEDCOM format which might allow Witness or witness roles to be accepted in one of the apps which converts GEDCOM data files for viewing on a mobile phone. I am afraid I dont have more time for it now - perhaps next winter.

[DonF]

Glad you've sorted that one now Evelyn.
With the census tags now identified properly as CENS, FH will import them as census (rather than misc. events of type census). It will also handle the witness roles now properly (I know, I've been through this change myself).
So then Gedstar will also get the right idea from an FH GEDOM import and I would HOPE would also pick up the witnesses correctly - that's the last bit I'm not sure of.

Good idea for there to be a definitive review of which phone apps (for which phone types?) can correctly import an FH GEDCOM file - has this been covered already in the FHUG? It would seem to be an obvious thing to do, and the way phones are becoming phablets, the screen sizes are getting useful....

Don

[tatewise]

There is the how_to:family_historian_on_imac_ipad_android_etc|> Family Historian on Mac, Linux, iOS, Android, etc advice, where any FHUG user can add more details about suitable apps.

However, to perform a comparative review requires an interested FHUG user to dedicate some time, effort, and a little money to experiment with several apps. Alternatively, some criteria need to be established against which apps can be measured. This topic needs a new thread to be started.

[E Wilcock]

I have now experimented further and am reporting back. Please note, my experiments bringing my TMG data into and out of FH 6.0.4 are just that. Playing around prior to any major and permanent transfer.

I ran into problems not relevant here when editing Event Tags in TMG.

So today I followed advice to convert my custom UK dated census Tags to the standard Census Tag offered in FH. I did this by successfully downloading and running the Change any Fact Tag. For which I was kindly sent guidance for another purpose by FH technical help today. Any TMG users changing Facts within FH should be aware of the double existence of all census Events in FH - both individual and family need to be changed.

The use of a standard Census Tag (as opposed to Custom) did not affect the import into GedStarPro. Custom tags were never a problem. But I have been convinced by advice in this thread that any tree held permanently in FH should be changed to benefit from the use of the standard Census tag in reports and plug ins.

Having changed the census entries, I did a trial GEDCOM export of a small group of people direct from FH software. I converted the file in Gedstar Pro and put it on my phone using Dropbox. The witness roles and events did not come through.

I then did the same thing but this time exported using Mike Tate's Eport GEDCOM File plug in. I downloaded and ran this with no problem today. I was not able to extract and export a limited group of people. Under the additional options I chose to export the witness roles as a Note. I converted the exported file using Gedstar Pro and put it on my phone.

I am pleased to report that the note to the Census Tag was enlarged to include the list of witnesses showing the roles and the ID number of the people present in that census household.

This note is not cross referenced. If you look at the records for the people in those witness roles, there is no census event or other entry under their individual record on my phone. This lack is not so vital in a household where the witnesses are the children of the couple. It could be more of a problem where a more distant child relative is staying, with an aunt or a grandparent and there is no record of that in the child's own fact or event list.

The other option offered for exporting witnesses in this plug in is to retain the custom tag. I have not yet tried this, as it has been explained to me on this Forum that what we have here is not a custom tag, but a non-standard Tag.

Hopefully someone else can now do better. Or do better using a different GDCOM reader for Android. But this is a start and my thanks to everyone who responded because I could not have done it without you.

[tatewise]

That is excellent progress.

FYI: If you wanted to use the Export Gedcom File Plugin with a subset Gedcom, then first export a small Gedcom as you did in your first experiment, open that in FH and run the Plugin on that subset. This is explained in the Plugin Help & Advice.

FYI: I agree the terminology can be confusing, but custom tag, user defined tag, and non-standard tag are often used interchangeably for proprietary Gedcom tags that are unlikely to be portable. Whereas Custom Events are well defined in the Gedcom standard and highly portable.

Including cross-reference Notes, or synthetic Facts, for the Witnesses is an interesting idea that I will investigate for a future version of the Plugin.

I hope someone can experiment with the option to Retain the Custom Tag for Witnesses to see if it transfers to GedStar Pro. If it does then that option can be added to the Plugin in a future version.

[E Wilcock]

I have spent some hours sorting out the various files and versions to make sure my report is accurate. I am not well versed in FH and frequently have difficulty locating the various exports.

I went back to the TMG file and made notes of how I had entered or not entered or even duplicated Census entries there. My group included a further witness example. A witness to a death event.

I then checked to see how the witness evens showed up on the direct import to FH.

In FH Witnesses do not show as a note on the original principal entries for 1861 or 1871 censuses. Nor do they show if I open the Notes tab.
The same goes when the Witness is to a Death - it shows on the witness record but not on the original death entry note.
Witness events in FH show up as shared events in the Facts for each witness.

I exported my small chosen group using the FH export facility, and reopened it in FH as Gollinshort2. Witness role events show in the record of the witnesses but not in the original tag or its notes.

Having reassured myself that my exported small group worked the same as the original complete project, I experimented with exporting a file that could be converted by Gedstar Pro.

My first try was to see if I could process the FH data file ged with Gedstar Pro - Gedstar gave me an error message

Line #1 found in GEDCOM file without a level number. File TCGedParse.cpp, line 194. (fatal error)

I then exported a Gedcom using FH export Gollinshort2a. No witness data opened on my phone. Not in the original Event, not in the witness facts.

I then exported a Gedcom using the plug in selecting the witness in notes. renamed it Gollinshort2b . The roles and Names of witnesses appear in the Note to the main entry for the Tag. No witness events show up in individual witness records e.g. Lionel's own record does not show him as a witness to his father's death. But his father's death record does show that son Lionel was a witness, (This result duplicated my partial success last night which was something of a relief.)

I then exported a Gedcom using the plug in selecting the retain custom event. renamed Gollinshort2c No witness data opened on my phone. not in the witness facts.

I did have a brief attempt to view FH Witness data with treeview (mentioned here on another thread) but had no success. The Gedstar example above with the data in Note is the only example so far where I have brought my TMG witness data onto my Android phone after transfer to another program.

[tatewise]

Excellent feedback, thank you.

Can you confirm that transferring your database directy from TMG to GedStar Pro does display the Witnesses associated with Principal Facts.

You say in FH Witnesses don't show on Principal facts for say Census & Death Events.
Perhaps you are unfamiliar with how to display them, so try this:
In the Facts tab select any Event that should have Witnesses.
In the More column to the right there shold be a Witness icon of three blue linked blobs.
Click the Cog Menu icon below, or right-click the Event, and select Witnesses....
This should display the Witnesses Dialogue window where the entries can be managed.
Click its Help button for details.

[E Wilcock]

I can answer the first part of your question Mike.

In my Gedstar app using the TMG project file, directly converted by Gedstar on a Windows computer.

The Census event opens and the Note is displayed, but there are two further buttons shown, one labelled sources and the other labelled Witnesses.
If you tap the Witnesses button it opens a list of the witnesses.
If you tap a name on the list of witness, you go to the record for that witness.
The same Census tag is repeated on the record for each witness.

However witness roles are not given either on the principal entry, nor that of the witnesses. The role is given as "Other".
I had not noticed that before. This tree was made probably before 1992, typing in census entries that had been copied out by my father and I dutifully typed his lists into the source or note fields, including the roles.

In the case of a Death with a witness, the witness button is present and the witness is correctly shown in the role of Witness.

Thank you with your help over the display on FH.

[E Wilcock]

For any TMG users choosing to alter within TMG any settings for the UK census Tags - Just a warning that I myself have run into trouble doing this.

The UK version (which was the only version I saved) is reporting that it cannot locate the necessary Data to change the gedcom type - probably not working as well as the simpler USA version would.

[DonF]

Just to clarify, there is no difference in the TMG program between the US and UK editions - neither is 'simpler' than the other.
I speak as a UK Edition user since it was first made available in 2002 (TMG 5.00).

The UK edition uses a 'UK English' by default (some slightly different spelling) and has a bunch of extra tags defined that are of possible benefit to the UK users (things like Manorial roll subsidies and other such esoteric stuff). The census tag also has more witness roles defined, but not as many as are really needed (I have about 40 in my versions).

I'm not sure what the error message is that you're getting, or what it really means as I've never struck it, but it will have nothing to do with UK/US Editions.

[E Wilcock]

Don - Thank you for your concern. This is really a question for a TMG Forum. I was seriously considering reverting to the USA version of TMG in order to convert my census Tags prior to import to FH.
Nor does adoption of the standard Census Tag, strongly recommended by FH people, really impinge on the ways and means of putting witness data from FH onto an Android phone. I will may be start another thread.

I am, by the way, pretty satisfied with the Gedstar Pro result from the plug in putting FH witness data in the Notes field. I like my trees on my phone as I walk about or travel mainly for addresses of where people lived, married and are buried.