* Deaths of seamen

[mrsangry999]

One of my ancestors was a Merchant Seaman, he's a big problem as he only appears on one census. He's on 1851 then wife is entered as a widow on 1861. If someone died on a voyage how would their wife be notified, please does anyone know? Would it be by whoever he worked for or just word of mouth?

He has a common name, and no likely death has been recorded according to GRO. Also I can't trace where he was born, so I'm completely at a dead end.

Thanks.

[AdrianBruce]

An interesting question - all I can say is that on the 1895 Crew List Agreement that I'm looking at (so this is a statistical sample of one!) there is a column for "Home address", with the printed note, "The Home Address is the one to which communications should be made in the event of the death of the Seaman".

So obviously, in 1895, someone had the expectation that the shipping company would communicate.

Having said that, in the case of the non-UK seamen, the address tends to be things like "Portugal" or "Paris". But even there, there is sometimes an entry for "Port of Engagement address", which is often a precise street address in an unknown town - probably Dundee, where the ship came from. What the significance of that address is, I don't know.

So I think there may be an expectation of the shipping company communicating but whether the Agreement always contained enough information, I doubt.

Any further comments gratefully received!

[tatewise]

Theoretically, I believe that every British Citizen should have their Birth, Marriage, and Death registered with the GRO, but where those events took place abroad they will not have a normal Registration District.

If you were prepared to disclose the details you have regarding Name, Age, Wife, Census Ref, Marriage Certificate, etc, then the FHUG members with experience of such searches would no doubt help.

[LornaCraig]

The National Archives series BT153 contains registers of the Registrar General of Shipping and Seamen containing entries of the receipt of dead sailors' wages and effects, or their proceeds, handed to Shipping Masters by the masters of British ships under the Seamen's Fund Winding-up Act 1851.

Here is the link:
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.u ... r?_q=BT153

I have an image of a page from 1865 (which I may have had to pay for - I can't remember). It has columns for deceased's name, name of ship, official number of ship, date of engagement, cause place and date of death, 'Effects, how disposed of' (hard to read but some seem to say "SU" and some "Letter L'pool"), total amount of wages and effects, and when details were sent to Board of Trade.

I traced this via Findmypast under their 'deaths at sea' transcriptions, which give just the date of death and the name of the ship and its home port, and refers to the BT153 series at the National Archives. I don't think the death was ever registered at the GRO.

Unfortunately nothing there gives a clue as to the seaman's age or place of birth, so it doesn't help trace things back any further, but it does confirm the death rather than leaving the possibility that he just chose never to return home! Does the 1851 census give his birthplace? Do you have his marriage certificate? That might give his age at marriage (although it might just say 'Full Age') and if you are lucky it will name his father and his father's occupation. However I agree that with a common name it's sometimes a hopeless task.

[mrsangry999]

Very strange, I didn't get notification that anyone had answered this question.

I asked the GRO to look at everything they had and they came up with nothing. Personally I think he may have been a "Wrong Un" There's no record of his baptism or father in his given lace of birth.

I have the few available details, marriage certificate etc but should I post them on another thread?

Thank you for answering.

[LornaCraig]

Have you tried the National Archives link I gave?
As I said, in the case of the person in my file I don't think the death was ever registered with the GRO, but Findmypast had basic transcriptions of the National Archives info.

Post whatever you have here and we'll see if we can help.

To be notified when someone has replied, tick the Notify me when reply is posted box below the text box when you type a message.

[P.S. by Mike Tate - see info:forums|> Forums Usage Tips for more about posting messages, replies, etc.]

[mrsangry999]

I tried the link but no record on there.

Edward Thomas Elliott, Mariner, married 3rd June 1845 (of full age) Father Edward Thomas Elliott, Woollen Draper. No family as witness - the clerk and a man called James Donovan. (I think he was a sail make or publican)

1851 census Thomas Elliot (wrong spelling and Mary Ann his wife couldn't write so perhaps census taker filled it out.) Age 33. Says born Bristol but there's no record of him or his father in the area. I've gone into this thoroughly with B&AFHS cds and loads of other places, Record Office etc. I've tried all kinds of spellings, followed "Elliott/Elliot" people through later census, posted on most websites and no-one claims him. Even his descendants whom I met online came to me for information, they knew less than I did. My relatives all died quite young before I was remotely interested and their families have no information. Nick Barratt looked up seamen's records in the National Archives and found some details which seem to be him, there was someone of that name who said he was born Bristol. I wonder if he was from an impoverished family or orphaned and the Merchant Venturers helped him get to sea?

Elliott/Elliot and variation is such a common name from Border Rievers, down to Dorset & Cornwall, Ireland too. I stopped researching four years ago because I was so disappointed about him.

If anyone has any ideas I would be grateful.

Thanks.

[LornaCraig]

Familysearch have a record of a possible baptism. Edward Thomas Elliot, 6 April 1817, at St. James, Bristol. Father Edward Elliot, mother Hester. Unfortunately they don't have an image. Here is the link:

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NFRX-V8R

[mrsangry999]

Thank you very much for looking for me. I think I saw that one a while ago but couldn't trace people of those names around Bristol. No mention of a Hester in any other records. There were other Elliotts/Ellyots in Bristol who ran a pub but they aren't related. I used to be really pie hot on my ancestors but since I stopped I'm nowhere near as good. Also at that time I didn't need to keep a log. Foolish woman!

In 1861 there was someone in a workhouse who was similar but I traced him further and it didn't match. There was also another sailor on 1861 in Weymouth. Not him, according to his descendants. An unusual name would have been good.

Thank you for your time at searching for me.
Regards.

[LornaCraig]

Well, I think that baptism is a strong candidate so unless you can rule it out for some reason I don't think you can say 'there is no record of him or his father in the area'. There were some Thomas/Edward Elliots in the surrounding Gloucestershire area a generation earlier too, though it may not be possible to prove the connection.

[mrsangry999]

Yes the baptism seems the nearest I've got to him, I think the father was down as a servant. I've looked at school records and found nothing.

I can't remember the exact date of 1851 census but Mary Ann lost a 2 year old daughter on 25th April.

Thank you again for the help. I don't think I'll ever give up on him.

Regards.