I had cause to use GC Backup today and I am very grateful that the program has this feature.
However, I discovered that, unlike FH, GC does not zip the backup files. I discovered that I have hundreds of backup files amounting to many megabytes.
Is it possible to either zip the backup files or else place a limit on the file size on the folder where they are stored so that an occasional spring clean could be carried out?
ID:2181
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andrewbraid
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Andrew Braid
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NickWalker
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It is an easy process just to occasionally click on the Tools menu and 'Remove old backup files...' to reduce to the most recent five backups.
TO be honest, I'd rather allow it to build up the backups in case any issues in the future cause GC to corrupt someones family tree file. Most people have far more hard-disk space than they know what to do with nowadays and even two hundred backups are unlikely to take up more than 0.5 Gb (depending on size of file obviously).
However, I will consider making it an option to limit to a number of backups in a future version.
Best wishes
TO be honest, I'd rather allow it to build up the backups in case any issues in the future cause GC to corrupt someones family tree file. Most people have far more hard-disk space than they know what to do with nowadays and even two hundred backups are unlikely to take up more than 0.5 Gb (depending on size of file obviously).
However, I will consider making it an option to limit to a number of backups in a future version.
Best wishes
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andrewbraid
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Nick
Sorry I had not actually clicked on the 'Remove old back up files' button assuming that it would delete them all.
I am quite happy with this solution.
Sorry I had not actually clicked on the 'Remove old back up files' button assuming that it would delete them all.
I am quite happy with this solution.
Andrew Braid
GC Backup
The only problem about keeping umpteen number of backups is keeping track of what you did between each backup. It also depends on how often you backup, after every run of the program, every day, every week. After only a few backups it's hard to remember what you did.
You learn quickly if you have a data corruption so it won't need many backups to go back to resolve the issue. If you only backup every now and then, then it's nearly always the last backup. If you backup every time you do something then yes you do need a few backups to cater for the situation where you don't realise the corruption for a while. This is why many programs don't backup every time they do something, so GC backup system is 'different' to say the least. If you want to keep many backups you might as well go to a journalling system and track the file changes and allow roll backs.
I would say bite the bullet Nick and be confident in your program. [cool] Do a bit more testing, it is not a swear word for programmers!
. By now, with quite a few people having used it and no reports about corruption you've pretty much done your beta testing! [smile]
There is another issue with GC keeping backups and FH keeping backups. Which backup do you restore from? You could work it out from the date stamp, but which one is the non-corrupt one?
PS. My full Gedcom is 5Mb (my cut down Axtell only one is 2Mb) so a backup after every census entry is extremely wasteful.
You learn quickly if you have a data corruption so it won't need many backups to go back to resolve the issue. If you only backup every now and then, then it's nearly always the last backup. If you backup every time you do something then yes you do need a few backups to cater for the situation where you don't realise the corruption for a while. This is why many programs don't backup every time they do something, so GC backup system is 'different' to say the least. If you want to keep many backups you might as well go to a journalling system and track the file changes and allow roll backs.
I would say bite the bullet Nick and be confident in your program. [cool] Do a bit more testing, it is not a swear word for programmers!
. By now, with quite a few people having used it and no reports about corruption you've pretty much done your beta testing! [smile]There is another issue with GC keeping backups and FH keeping backups. Which backup do you restore from? You could work it out from the date stamp, but which one is the non-corrupt one?
PS. My full Gedcom is 5Mb (my cut down Axtell only one is 2Mb) so a backup after every census entry is extremely wasteful.
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NickWalker
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I am regularly releasing new versions of Gedcom Census and as people may enter 30 or 40 new census records in a day it is just possible that a new feature could cause a problem and it could be useful to go back to a much earlier backup. It is also possible (though unlikely) that they may not use Family Historian in between so these may be the only backups they have. Yes it it is very unlikely the backups will be required and I have faith in my software but family history data is very precious to people and I don't need a disaster on my conscience particularly when I do this for fun and not for money.
Having said that the facility is there to delete all but the last 5 backups which seems a fair compromise.
I do feel slightly insulted (though I'm sure you didn't mean to and there are lots of smileys, etc.) by the 'do a bit more testing' comment. In my professional programming life I do very thorough testing and have long ago been very well educated in formal methods, etc. Gedcom Census is something I do for free in what very little spare time I can find in between the very long working days and a busy family life and various other hobbies. Each version of Gedcom Census does get Beta Tested by users and the versions I have released on this website have never been beta versions.
Having said that the facility is there to delete all but the last 5 backups which seems a fair compromise.
I do feel slightly insulted (though I'm sure you didn't mean to and there are lots of smileys, etc.) by the 'do a bit more testing' comment. In my professional programming life I do very thorough testing and have long ago been very well educated in formal methods, etc. Gedcom Census is something I do for free in what very little spare time I can find in between the very long working days and a busy family life and various other hobbies. Each version of Gedcom Census does get Beta Tested by users and the versions I have released on this website have never been beta versions.
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ireneblackburn
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As a user of FH I am far more concerned with my Family History data being saved than I am about someone's idea of 'good programming'. I think my research is of far more importance than someone's idea of how many backups should be made. It is easy to remove old backups it would be impossible to recreate my files.
Keep up the good work Nick, most of us are very grateful.
Irene B
Keep up the good work Nick, most of us are very grateful.
Irene B
Irene
My family tree is full of nuts
My family tree is full of nuts
GC Backup
I wasn't trying to be insulting about the testing bit (the smilies where deliberate), just from my experience not many programmers are keen on it because of they want to do the nice stuff of writing new code. I too like you have gone through various formal methods of testing. I just wasn't aware how much you do test that's all.
Taking into account your description of how GC could be used I take on board that GC's backups could be be the only ones to restore to. Though that's only if they don't use FH's backup system. As for backing up after every entry I would say that in my view that's like saving a document after typing in every paragraph. I would counter in that case that your software needn't do any backups at all (yippee less code to maintain! [wink]) so long as the user is encouraged to backup before using GC. Then there is only one backup to roll back too, and it would be the earliest since it's before GC started. If GC does corrupt a gedcom, it will in all probability do it in all backups.
It's all about maintenance. Creating a couple hundred backups which take up less than 0.5Gb is fine in terms of space with a small Gedcom, but a nightmare in terms of clogging up your directories with unnecessary files. The default of being hidden in the program files directory doesn't help in terms of monitoring the number of backup files. Even in a my documents directory the backup count will need monitoring. The remove old backup files option helps on this aspect.
Thinking about how many users use their computers I have found in my experience that having many backups confuses the average user. Unless they are exceptionally organised noting which backup to use is difficult, especially when they are just date stamped. Restoring by a single day or few days is alright, but beyond that gets difficult. A single backup at the start of a session makes the selection of what to restore from a lot easier.
Sidetracking a bit to the point about backup location a bit further, wouldn't my documents be a better place for backups rather than program files which is a more appropriate location. Alternatively, the same directory as the Gedcom being edited could be the choice. The same is true with the log file's location.
Just to add some feedback to you on how GC is used, I personally use it with FH active. That way I can see which people I need to add based on named lists/queries and also so I can see their details as many already have census details in various formats which need re-editing.
One final point, you can't turn off the backups if you have your own system or if you always use FH's backup system.
I'm happy to carry on this discussion by email to save cloging up FHUG with technical talk. [wink]
Feel free to ignore me or disagree with me, these are just my own opinionated views and are not about your programming skills, just feedback about how GC could be made better (or worse if you disagree). [smile]
PS. Sorry to the OP for hijacking his initial question with techno mumbo-jumbo. [confused][mad][grin]
Taking into account your description of how GC could be used I take on board that GC's backups could be be the only ones to restore to. Though that's only if they don't use FH's backup system. As for backing up after every entry I would say that in my view that's like saving a document after typing in every paragraph. I would counter in that case that your software needn't do any backups at all (yippee less code to maintain! [wink]) so long as the user is encouraged to backup before using GC. Then there is only one backup to roll back too, and it would be the earliest since it's before GC started. If GC does corrupt a gedcom, it will in all probability do it in all backups.
It's all about maintenance. Creating a couple hundred backups which take up less than 0.5Gb is fine in terms of space with a small Gedcom, but a nightmare in terms of clogging up your directories with unnecessary files. The default of being hidden in the program files directory doesn't help in terms of monitoring the number of backup files. Even in a my documents directory the backup count will need monitoring. The remove old backup files option helps on this aspect.
Thinking about how many users use their computers I have found in my experience that having many backups confuses the average user. Unless they are exceptionally organised noting which backup to use is difficult, especially when they are just date stamped. Restoring by a single day or few days is alright, but beyond that gets difficult. A single backup at the start of a session makes the selection of what to restore from a lot easier.
Sidetracking a bit to the point about backup location a bit further, wouldn't my documents be a better place for backups rather than program files which is a more appropriate location. Alternatively, the same directory as the Gedcom being edited could be the choice. The same is true with the log file's location.
Just to add some feedback to you on how GC is used, I personally use it with FH active. That way I can see which people I need to add based on named lists/queries and also so I can see their details as many already have census details in various formats which need re-editing.
One final point, you can't turn off the backups if you have your own system or if you always use FH's backup system.
I'm happy to carry on this discussion by email to save cloging up FHUG with technical talk. [wink]
Feel free to ignore me or disagree with me, these are just my own opinionated views and are not about your programming skills, just feedback about how GC could be made better (or worse if you disagree). [smile]
PS. Sorry to the OP for hijacking his initial question with techno mumbo-jumbo. [confused][mad][grin]
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NickWalker
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A GC entry makes changes to various places in the GEDCOM file and therefore without developing a fairly complicated transaction logging system it is far easier to backup the whole file. Your analogy of backing up after each paragraph change isn't really correct, it is more like making a backup after changing 20 paragraphs at various places within the document. As I said, this may be over the top but is the safest bet.
Backing up to the installation folder isn't ideal but can be changed if need be. One positive effect of this is that at least if you are regularly backing up your my documents you don't get the Gedcom Census backup files in there too!
The backup files may confuse people but if a GC disaster does strike it will allow me to talk through (via email) the issue with the inexperienced user. A more experienced user will be able to work out what to do.
I think most people use GC with Family Historian open in the way you describe. It works particularly well like this with FH and GC each spotting when the other has updated. Though it would be good if Family Historian refocused back on to the record you were looking at before the reload.
Backing up to the installation folder isn't ideal but can be changed if need be. One positive effect of this is that at least if you are regularly backing up your my documents you don't get the Gedcom Census backup files in there too!
The backup files may confuse people but if a GC disaster does strike it will allow me to talk through (via email) the issue with the inexperienced user. A more experienced user will be able to work out what to do.
I think most people use GC with Family Historian open in the way you describe. It works particularly well like this with FH and GC each spotting when the other has updated. Though it would be good if Family Historian refocused back on to the record you were looking at before the reload.