* Feeling stupid...again...

AS allows faster and more convenient creation of source records for Family Historian.
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fhtess65
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Feeling stupid...again...

Post by fhtess65 »

Each time I try to use AS, I get almost all the way through and then get thrown for a loop. I launched AS from Sarah Blundell Hills profile in FH7, from her death fact. Created (or so I thought) the death entry - got to the point where I THOUGHT I was finished and clicked save, then AS tells me I haven't designated an individual. Sarah is highlighted and the only place I can see in the template to enter her name is greyed out. I assumed that because Sarah was highlighted on the right that AS knew she was the person. What am I doing wrong? It is SOOOOOO frustrating to make this work. See screencaps below...
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DeathEntry#1.png
DeathEntry#1.png (164.75 KiB) Viewed 1596 times
DeathEntry#2.png
DeathEntry#2.png (66.48 KiB) Viewed 1596 times
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Teresa Basińska Eckford
Librarian & family historian
http://writingmypast.wordpress.com
Researching: Spong, Ferdinando, Taylor, Lawley, Sinkins, Montgomery; Basiński, Hilferding, Ratowski, Paszkiewicz
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mjashby
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by mjashby »

Teresa,

You need to press "Select" in the second box on the right can side of the first screenshot to carry the name across to input screen (and, of course, confirm that the correct individual has been highlighted).

Mervyn
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fhtess65
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by fhtess65 »

mjashby wrote: 25 Jun 2022 17:39 Teresa,

You need to press "Select" in the second box on the right can side of the first screenshot to carry the name across to input screen (and, of course, confirm that the correct individual has been highlighted).

Mervyn
Thanks, Mervyn, but then I get this:
DeathEntry#3.png
DeathEntry#3.png (33.13 KiB) Viewed 1584 times
The workflow just isn't intuitive to me and I've been using software for 30+ years...
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Teresa Basińska Eckford
Librarian & family historian
http://writingmypast.wordpress.com
Researching: Spong, Ferdinando, Taylor, Lawley, Sinkins, Montgomery; Basiński, Hilferding, Ratowski, Paszkiewicz
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NickWalker
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by NickWalker »

I think it's fairly standard behaviour in any type of software to have to select a record by from a list and choose the record by clicking a button or by double-clicking it.

AS is then warning you that you already have a death fact recorded for this person (Great Yarmouth in May 1919) and is making sure you are happy for AS to replace this with a new death fact. Again I think AS is doing the right thing here in checking you are happy for it to replace your existing data rather than just going ahead and doing so. The message says "Click yes if you want to replace this existing fact..." which you presumably want to, so just click Yes.
Nick Walker
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https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/ancestral-sources/
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mjashby
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by mjashby »

Teresa,

Nick beat me to answer but looking at your screenshots I was also going to say just choose 'Yes'

The screen is asking for confirmation that you want to replace the existing Death Fact, which has no sources with a new Sourced Fact (the normal situation), or add the fact as an alternative Death Fact. If the existing Fact already had a Source or multiple Sources, you would also see options to choose whether or not they should be attached to the new Fact.

I believe Nick has programmed the prompts to maximise data protection for the user, because once changes have been committed, if an error is found later it can be a complex task to undo those changes.

Once you've run through the workflow a few times I'm sure you'll be O.K. but, in the early stages, the hand-holding might seem a little complex. Perhaps think in terms those enterprise databases or online payment systems that ask you to confirm that what they are about to record is really what you intended; and then ask "Are you sure? Are you really sure?"

Mervyn
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Martin Tolley
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by Martin Tolley »

@Mervyn. In my job we had to use an American-written student management system called Blackboard. In order to delete any record for a student, incorrect mark etc we got the following dialogues "Delete?": [click delete button] "Are you sure you want to delete? Confirm": [click confirm button], "Confirm Yes / No [click Yes button]: "Type Y E S followed by enter to confirm" Retirement was a blessed release.
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by fhtess65 »

Nick,

To me, because it's highlighted, and I opened AS from Sarah's FH profile, on her death fact, I assumed it already knew and had added her.

My other confusion is that I assumed I was creating the source/citation in AS and attaching it to an existing fact, NOT creating the fact in AS. It might seem obvious to others, but to me, it wasn't clear. My fault entirely for not paying enough attention and reading more about how AS works. I tend to plunge in and just try.

Thanks for the help :)

Teresa



NickWalker wrote: 25 Jun 2022 18:02 I think it's fairly standard behaviour in any type of software to have to select a record by from a list and choose the record by clicking a button or by double-clicking it.

AS is then warning you that you already have a death fact recorded for this person (Great Yarmouth in May 1919) and is making sure you are happy for AS to replace this with a new death fact. Again I think AS is doing the right thing here in checking you are happy for it to replace your existing data rather than just going ahead and doing so. The message says "Click yes if you want to replace this existing fact..." which you presumably want to, so just click Yes.
---
Teresa Basińska Eckford
Librarian & family historian
http://writingmypast.wordpress.com
Researching: Spong, Ferdinando, Taylor, Lawley, Sinkins, Montgomery; Basiński, Hilferding, Ratowski, Paszkiewicz
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fhtess65
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by fhtess65 »

Thanks for the feedback. And yes, I know part of the issue is me not using AS consistently - just dipping in and out so I don't establish a workflow. It didn't help yesterday that I had a crashing headache while trying to work in AS - my pain and frustration came through in my post and was directed at myself for not understanding, but I realize it came across as critique of AS. I'm very grateful to Nick for the program and the support he provides.

Teresa
mjashby wrote: 25 Jun 2022 18:37 Teresa,
<SNIP>
I believe Nick has programmed the prompts to maximise data protection for the user, because once changes have been committed, if an error is found later it can be a complex task to undo those changes.

Once you've run through the workflow a few times I'm sure you'll be O.K. but, in the early stages, the hand-holding might seem a little complex. Perhaps think in terms those enterprise databases or online payment systems that ask you to confirm that what they are about to record is really what you intended; and then ask "Are you sure? Are you really sure?"

Mervyn
---
Teresa Basińska Eckford
Librarian & family historian
http://writingmypast.wordpress.com
Researching: Spong, Ferdinando, Taylor, Lawley, Sinkins, Montgomery; Basiński, Hilferding, Ratowski, Paszkiewicz
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NickWalker
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by NickWalker »

fhtess65 wrote: 26 Jun 2022 16:24 To me, because it's highlighted, and I opened AS from Sarah's FH profile, on her death fact, I assumed it already knew and had added her.
If just highlighting someone added them it would cause all sorts of issues - for example you may highlight someone because you want to add a parent, or child to them. Also if you're searching for someone using the search box at the top it will highlight the first person who matches the search who may not be the individual you were looking for.
My other confusion is that I assumed I was creating the source/citation in AS and attaching it to an existing fact, NOT creating the fact in AS. It might seem obvious to others, but to me, it wasn't clear. My fault entirely for not paying enough attention and reading more about how AS works. I tend to plunge in and just try.
If you think about it there isn't really any difference between editing an existing fact (replacing the date, place and address) and replacing the existing fact with a new fact with the date, place and address in, new citation, etc. Under the AS Options (first page) some users opt to create multiple death facts (and multiple birth facts) so each time they get a source for the death of an individual they create a new additional death fact for them. It's not something that I would ever want to do, but AS has to cater for all sorts of recording methods!
Nick Walker
Ancestral Sources Developer

https://fhug.org.uk/kb/kb-article/ancestral-sources/
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fhtess65
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by fhtess65 »

Hi Nick,

Thanks for the additional information. What you say makes sense - my mind just works differently :lol: . Now you've explained it to me, I see what you mean. I have yet to figure out how to apply my own edited templates from FH (tried, but failed) to give me my Strathclyde citations, but that's a job for another day. I've seen discussions elsewhere on this part of the forum, so will look them up when I come back to it.

I do appreciate all the work you do and your generosity.

Teresa
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Teresa Basińska Eckford
Librarian & family historian
http://writingmypast.wordpress.com
Researching: Spong, Ferdinando, Taylor, Lawley, Sinkins, Montgomery; Basiński, Hilferding, Ratowski, Paszkiewicz
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Re: Feeling stupid...again...

Post by Valkrider »

NickWalker wrote: 26 Jun 2022 16:59 If you think about it there isn't really any difference between editing an existing fact (replacing the date, place and address) and replacing the existing fact with a new fact with the date, place and address in, new citation, etc. Under the AS Options (first page) some users opt to create multiple death facts (and multiple birth facts) so each time they get a source for the death of an individual they create a new additional death fact for them. It's not something that I would ever want to do, but AS has to cater for all sorts of recording methods!
I do record multiple facts against events as they often differ in some degree and it is useful to see all of them imho.
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