* Grandchild, parent unknown

[ColinMc]

How do others deal with this issue.

I have an 1851 English census where the head of the household, Samuel Salt, has three adult children, all showing the same surname, two males and a daughter. In addition, there is a granddaughter with surname Neville.

A quick search on the Internet seems to suggest (if this is the right person) from a Marriage record that her father is William Neville, but no mention here of mother.

I obviously need to research this further, but in the meantime, how would others enter her in FH. As the child of the only daughter living at home, or possibly the child of an as yet unidentified daughter? Or as an un-related person?

As Samuel is 52 at this census there could easily be other daughters. All I know as a fact (or at least a possible fact) is that the child is a grand-daughter of Samuel.

[ColeValleyGirl]

I'd add an unknown daughter to the Salt family, add a Neville husband without a forename to that unknown daughter, and make the granddaughter a child of that couple. All with copious notes explaining why.

Then when you track down her parents,you just edit the relevant individuals -- or merge the Salt daughter with a known daughter if that's the way things turn out.

[ColinMc]

I like that solution.

Thanks, I'll do it

[DavidNewton]

A quick rummage around Family Search leads me to think we are talking of Selina Neville, If not then the rest of this post is irrelevant. Looking through one or two free sites gives:

William Nevill married Mary Salt 11 Feb 1846 (Warwickshire Parish Records from Family Search)

Selina Neville birth registration (from FreeBMD. I can't locate her in the Gov Births to verify the mother's maiden name))
Jun 1849, Selina Neville, Lichfield, v7, p87

Selina Neville baptised 1 May 1849 father William Nevill, mother Mary (England Births and Christenings from Family Search)

David

[ColinMc]

Yes, that seems to be her. Selina is resident with grandfather in 1851, in the census, but no mention of Mary.

I was a little hesitant to divert onto this line, as I suspected it would lead down a few blind alleys.

Samuel (g'father) seems to have found himself a new wife by 1861 census (he's 62, she's 24),, and he has another grandson living with him then. He then goes on to have 7 children with the new wife!

So I suspected there may be a few as yet un-identified children from marriage 1. That's a task for another day, but thanks very much for the extra info. Much appreciated

[tatewise]

My searches on FindMyPast add some confusion as there are two sets of entries:
FreeBMD has the same two GRO Birth entries, but the GRO website is down at present.

1) Selina Neville with e
GRO Birth: Q2 1849 Lichfield, Staffs, v17 p87, Mother's maiden name unknown
Baptism: 02 Mar 1853 born:19 Sep 1850 Whittington, Staffs, Father: John Neville Mother: Mary

2) Selina Nevill without e
GRO Birth: Q4 1850 Q4 Lichfield, Staffs, v17 p72, Mother's maiden name: Stretton
Baptism: 01 May 1849 Lichfield, Staffs, Father: William Nevill Mother: Mary

They all have supporting images that confirm the surnames with and without e.
However, it looks like the surnames have got swapped around.
The GRO Birth: Q2 1849 unknown belongs with the Baptism: 01 May 1849 for William & Mary
The GRO Birth: Q4 1850 Stretton belongs with the Baptism: 02 Mar 1853 born:19 Sep 1850 for John & Mary

William Nevill & Mary Salt
GRO Marriage: Q1 1846 Aston, Warwickshire, v16 p256
Marriage: 11 Feb 1846 Aston Juxta Birmingham, Warwickshire

John Nevill & Mary Stretton
GRO Marriage: Q4 1837 Lichfield, Staffs, v17 p108
Marriage: 25 Dec 1837 Whittington, Staffs, Fathers: Francis Nevill & Charles Stretton

[ColinMc]

That does add to the confusion. Thanks tho.

I'll try and have a look at this myself next week. I must finish the line I'm working on which is a Canadian one before I come back to this one.

All the additional info is much appreciated tho.

[tatewise]

I have found the following 1851 Census records:

Lichfield HO107 Piece 2014 Folio 20 Page 32
John Nevill, wife Mary (nee Stretton), daughter Selina (i.e. the other Selina Nevill)

Lichfield HO107 Piece 2014 Folio 329 Page 24 (with Brooks family)
Mary Nevill Visitor Widow born 1823 Lichfield, Staffordshire (that fits with her Salt family)
That would explain why William Nevill cannot be found and Selina is in the care of her grandfather.

William Nevill
GRO Death: Q4 1849 Lichfield, Staffs
Burial: 02 Oct 1849 Lichfield, Staffs Age 27 Born 1822

[ColinMc]

Thanks again.

Making a bit more sense now.

[jmurphy]

For linking grandparents and grandchildren, I don't like to use a dummy parent. Sometimes I add unnamed children to a tree because of a child count in a census, or because of un-named survivors in an obituary (as a reminder that there may be more people to look for). Suppose now I that I have done so, I come across a census with a grandchild or nephew/niece where it isn't apparent what the actual connection is. If I add a dummy, I throw off my child count. If I pick one of the unknown children to link this new younger person to, I'm putting in more information that isn't in evidence.

My solution for the problem is to use the Associated person feature to link grandparents and grandchildren or uncles/aunts and nephews/nieces when the children's parents are unknown. This allows me to record the information that the two are associated in a record and keep them 'together' until I have determined what the actual relationship is.

This is what works for me -- of course we all have to do what makes the most sense to us. Leaving a note about what you've done can also be helpful, assuming you remember to read your notes.

[gwilym'smum]

Dear Colin
It has just occurred to me that in 1871 it appears that the family of my 2x gt grandparents had split up. Mother, Sarah, took her son, my gt grandmother went to live with her uncle. However the eldest daughter, Alice Jane went to live with a family named Gregory. She is listed as "granddaughter". Now I know for certain that she was not their granddaughter, I don't even know of a definite connection between the families.
Previously when there was a grandchild with unknown parents I have added an unknown daughter to the grandparents until I could sort it out later with perhaps the grandchild's marriage certificate where the father might have been listed, which would perhaps have been a hint.
It was just that I recalled my situation. I did know the parents so I just recorded the information with a comment regarding the relationship
All the best
Ann

[ColinMc]

Ann

That does seem to be the optimal solution