* FH 6.2 - FindMyPast Hints

[AdrianBruce]

OK Mike - yes, I was missing that the FMP search could be done without logging in. Though a free search could be done just by looking in the UK (say) collections. But then, as we say, confining that search could result in missing useful hints for those who emigrated.

It's just that the current inability to dismiss hints outside the subscription area is clearly severely clunky, clunky enough for me to wonder how it got through testing. One possible explanation for me was that Calico Pie had a worldwide subs. Another that they only had a UK subs, and got UK only responses, but FMP's peculiar inconsistency in setting the enquiry scope sabotaged the logic. Evidently, that's not the way the logic works. Fair enough.

[ColeValleyGirl]

If I'm reading the FIndMyPast API documentation correctly, there's no way to specify the scope of the search -- so Calico Pie can't implement one at the FH end...

[AdrianBruce]

Thank you Helen. Curious that, given that the first thing I do in a browser session is set what collections I want it to look at. Maybe this explains why sometimes I end up searching the World collections - I'm getting in through a route that uses the collection-less API and I'm not recognising that different route.

[tatewise]

Whatever the solution, it must cope with say USA users who access the USA FMP site at http://www.findmypast.com/ and only have a USA/Canada subscription; and similarly for users in other regions.

[ColeValleyGirl]

Mike, no doubt FMP will improve their API over time -- if it's in their commercial interest to do so. Perhaps Calico Pie will be able to exert some influence, as may other software providers who decide to take advantage of the API.

[gerrynuk]

Thank you for your patience, Mike.

Gerry, did you read and digest how_to:copy_paste_and_drag_drop|> Copy & Paste and Drag & Drop?
Do you understand the difference between short text fields, and long text fields that allow multiple lines?

Yes I have and I do, thank you.

... As the Knowledge Base says, you cannot paste or drop or edit or create multi-line text in a short text field such as a Name field. You can only get multiple lines into a long text field such as a Note or Text From Source.

Yes, I do understand that. However, the hint page displayed by FMP is broken into short segments e.g. a Forename, a Surname, a Quarter, a year etc so dragging and dropping part of a name (Mary or Smith, for example) from FMP into a FH field that takes a full name does not seem to me to be very useful. Equally, dragging a Quarter or Year (3 or 1915, for example) into a field that takes both again seems to be less than helpful. In any case it is usually much quicker to type it in, even for a two-finger typist like me. Clearly dragging anything useful like a full name of a full date seems not to be possible in the examples I have seen so far so I don't really understand what benefit this facility provides. Dragging longer portions of text into multiline fields is certainly possible but the results seem to be unpredictable and may end up needing further editing to eliminate non-printing characters.

...
In the past I suspect you would have used copy & paste to copy a transcript from FMP to the Text From Source field in a new Source record. FH V6.0 simply added drag & drop as just another way of doing the same thing.

No, I rarely did this for the reasons explained above - in most cases it just isn't useful because FMP data isn't usually presented in a form suitable to copying in that way.

Then you would create Citations that linked to that Source record. Alternatively, you could use the Automatic Source Citations pane or Ancestral Sources to create the Source record, but drag & drop is just a quick way of entering the transcript into a text field.
The Internet Data Matches feature is quite separate from all the above, and does not change how any of it works. It simply offers you automatic 'hints' to online records, instead of you searching for them manually. Thereafter, the process of adding Source Citations is essentially the same as it has been for years.

Understood.

[tatewise]

I agree that in many cases the text in a web page is a different format from what FH requires in a text field, and thus copy & paste and drag & drop are of little use.

The main use is in creating Text From Source transcripts, but only if the web page text layout is suitable.

To go any further and automatically copy Names into FH Name fields, or Dates into FH Date fields, would required FH to understand and analyse web page text, and keep up with any web site changes. I suspect that is unlikely to happen in the foreseeable future.

I think you now understand that FMP 'hints' have no impact on copy & paste and drag & drop.

It would have been useful if drag & drop of FMP document images worked.

[gerrynuk]

...
It would have been useful if drag & drop of FMP document images worked.

Indeed and I hope that FH and FMP can get this to work.

[davidf]

Mike, no doubt FMP will improve their API over time -- if it's in their commercial interest to do so. Perhaps Calico Pie will be able to exert some influence, as may other software providers who decide to take advantage of the API.

But given that I think just changing findmypast.co.uk/ to findmypast.com/ seems to get me to the .com site to which I have a world subscription, can't this be handled by FH in the configuration by either:
1) duplicating the code for findmypast(.co.uk) to create a findmypast(.com) option - where the only difference is in the code that creates the URL for the hint reporting page, or,
2) offering a configuration for the findmypast option so we can specify .co.uk, .com. etc. and use the choice to create the URL etc.?

I don't know whether there are other complications to handle - because I can't get the FMP hints to work without the above manual intervention which I think breaks the process!

Update 6 April 2016: See resolution below http://www.fhug.org.uk/forum/viewtopic. ... 345#p68345

[AdrianBruce]

... changing findmypast.co.uk/ to findmypast.com/ seems to get me to the .com site to which I have a world subscription,...

Dangerous comment, considering I don't have a World subs to FMP, but this sounds odd. Subscriptions are not generally tied to the URL. I got my UK subs for FMP via the co.uk site but I can log onto the .com site with my FMP details and successfully do queries there.

Having said that, when I just went there to check, the first thing it did was suggest I go to the .co.uk site - this was before I logged in and the decision to do that must have been solely based on my IP address. Could it be that extra step that confuses things, if David has a sort-of-American URL?

[ColeValleyGirl]

From the FMP API documentation:

The endpoint to call our API is:
http://api.findmypast.com/search/category/count

No .co.uk option for FH to use to generate the list of hints. (I've tested and the .com url returns an error message complaining that I haven't specified the paramaters correctly; the .co.uk gives 404 not found).

(The API is at https://github.com/findmypast/public_docs if anyone else wants to take a look.

My hints list when displayed is from .co.uk but doesn't change if I modify that to .com

[tatewise]

Yes, if you visit a distant FMP site from UK (findmypast.com, findmypast.ie, findmypast.com.au) then it suggests you may be at the wrong site, but if I bypass that, it allows me to login to any site with my UK subscription, so I would be surprised if a World subscription was tied to a particular site.

Anyway, as Helen says, the FMP API used by FH is focussed on the findmypast.com USA URL.

[quarlton]

Does anyone know if it is possible to query whether or not a person has any hints?
e.g. Show me all people who have an active FMP Hint

At the moment the only way, as far as I'm aware, to find out who has or hasn't any hints is by visiting each person through the Focus window.

It would be nice to be able to identify those still with hints in list format so that I can see who still has to be dealt with.

Many thanks

Dave

[tatewise]

Yes Dave, that would be extremely useful, but as far as I am aware the 'hints' are only available via the Focus Window, and yes that is a tedious method to check for them all.

[ColeValleyGirl]

Does anyone know if it is possible to query whether or not a person has any hints?

Sounds like something for the wishlist, as does the ability to restrict hints to a particular geographic region.

[Pentris]

The idea to be able to see who has hints is implemented in Ancestry on their tree layout. It also allows you to view all hints or selected types from a menu choice option. Similarly it should be possible for Calico Pie to introduce that in FH.

[kbella]

Good news that Family Historian can now link and obtain hints from FindMyPast…….even better would be a percentage reduction in subscription similar to that one can obtain from MyHeritage.....(hint hint).

Shiriki

Do you belong to any genealogical societies? If so, it is very easy for them to arrange a discount for their members.

[johnmorrisoniom]

It's a shame that there are no hints linked to the 1939 Register.

[willowherb]

I agree it's nice to have hints, but I would like to be able to reject the hint without having to go to FMP/My Heritage to see it.

Like many I do not have a world-wide sub to FMP and just want to get rid of what I know is an erroneous hint quickly

[NickWalker]

Which records does the FindMyPast try to match - for my tree I'm only seeing the standard sources birth/baptism/marriage/census/death/burial? I was talking to someone today who has their tree stored in FindMyPast (I think it was FMP rather than Ancestry) and said that they got some useful hints including one which informed them of an individual who spent a few days in prison and that was a surprise as they would never have even thought of looking for them in those records. That does sound very useful but I assume that kind of hint isn't going to pop up in Family Historian?

[davidf]

Dangerous comment, considering I don't have a World subs to FMP, but this sounds odd. Subscriptions are not generally tied to the URL. I got my UK subs for FMP via the co.uk site but I can log onto the .com site with my FMP details and successfully do queries there.

Interesting and thanks for pointing out the possibility; illustrates the dangers of multiple log-ins and a password manager!

I have at various times created separate logins for findmypast.com, findmypast.co.uk and findmypast.ie (and similar for Ancestry.com/.com.au/.co.uk). This was when different flavours would have different "free week-ends", different newsletters, etc. Findmypast.com then had a very good offer for their new World sub and I signed up to the .com site.

So my .com login has full World subscription rights - but the others don't. And the password manager matches the password to the URL (it's a security benefit of a password manager ensuring you only put a password into the genuine intended website and not a slightly different phishing site!), so I could not automatically log on to the .co.uk site with my .com id and password!

A bit of password vault manipulation and I can now easily use my .com ID on the .co.uk website - provided I select the external browser! (I have yet to get my password manager to work with FH's internal browser- one thing at a time!).

Thanks for getting me to investigate.

[NickWalker]

Which records does the FindMyPast try to match - for my tree I'm only seeing the standard sources birth/baptism/marriage/census/death/burial? I was talking to someone today who has their tree stored in FindMyPast (I think it was FMP rather than Ancestry) and said that they got some useful hints including one which informed them of an individual who spent a few days in prison and that was a surprise as they would never have even thought of looking for them in those records. That does sound very useful but I assume that kind of hint isn't going to pop up in Family Historian?

I've just had a look at the documentation for the hint API and it seems that the page of hints that is displayed is completely controlled by FMP and they don't mention any particular list of source types that could come back so perhaps there may be some other sources - if anyone has hints for other source types it would be interesting to know.

[ColeValleyGirl]

There are 2 apis -- the hints api and a 'related Search API'. -- I'm not clear which one FH is using. The Hints APIshould give better results than the Related Search API , but my results suggest it's a the related search API -- I'd love to be proven wrong..

[quarlton]

Which records does the FindMyPast try to match - for my tree I'm only seeing the standard sources birth/baptism/marriage/census/death/burial?

My wife had a hint yesterday that was listed as 'Birth' which was in fact 'British Civil Service Evidence of Age'. It was a declaration made by a father as to the date of birth for his daughter - whose birth he had not registered.

So it is picking up other non-standard bits and pieces.

Dave

[NickWalker]

There are 2 apis -- the hints api and a 'related Search API'. -- I'm not clear which one FH is using. The Hints APIshould give better results than the Related Search API , but my results suggest it's a the related search API -- I'd love to be proven wrong..

Why do you think that? The results page has a URL that include the word 'hints' and the support for the accepted/rejected functionality suggests it uses the hints API I think?