* Upgrading to v5 - changes to file structures?

[Sharon]

After trialling it on another PC, I have just purchased v5 and am about to install it on the PC which currently has v3 and all my family history files and folders on it. This PC is running Windows Vista - Home premium.

I've done all my backups, and I'm ready to install, but I just wanted to clarify a couple of things before I go ahead, and would be grateful for any advice.

I read somewhere on here that v5 demands a specific file structure for media etc. However, I currently use FHv3 in conjunction with another piece of software (TNG - The Next Generation) that allows me to publish my tree etc to the web, and that also demands a spcific file structure for media, documents etc.

Also, I currently have v3 installed on my C: , with all my data on E:. I would prefer v5 to be installed on the E: drive if possible for reasons of space.

So my questions are :
1. Will v5 allow me to choose where to install it?
2. If I do install it on C:, will it insist I keep my data on the same drive?
3. I understand I can use my own file structure, but will I be missing out on any of the benefits of using the structure preferred by v5?

Many thanks,
Sharon

[tatewise]

In your previous posting Upgrading to 5 with customised diagrams (10782) we recommended you look at how_to:v4:understanding_projects|> Understanding Projects for details of migrating from V3 standalone GEDCOM to the V5 Project structure.
There it advises to read the Help under Notes for Upgrading Users, where under Frequently Asked Questions it talks about upgrading from version 3 and having a system for organising multimedia files.

To answer you questions:

1. V5 will allow you to choose where to install it, but I would STRONGLY advise against it.
There are too many snags associated with attempting using other than C:\Program Files\...
It will consume very little more space than V3 anyway.

2. You can keep you data & media files on the E: drive (or any other drive) just as you do now.
This is covered in the how_to:v4:understanding_projects|> Understanding Projects advice under Project Structure.

3. If you keep your own standalone file structure, you will be missing out on the benefits of using the Project structure preferred by v5.
As the how_to:v4:understanding_projects|> Understanding Projects explains under Project Benefits, there are many benefits and features of V5 Projects that are not available to standalone GEDCOM structured data.
However, you can have your cake and eat it, because you can keep your current Media folder structure, but simply recreated within the Project Media folder.

[Jane]

You might also like to check out the plugin specifically for exporting for TNG and other programs which converts the media, resizes it if wanted and "chops up" face links so the images you see in TNG are the same as the ones you see in FH.
e.g.
Export Gedcom to TNG Plugin.
Convert File Links Plugin

[Sharon]

Thank you both for your help.

@ tatewise: I had read the articles at the link you provided, and I'm sorry if my questions sounded as though I hadn't bothered. I think I may not have stated my questions clearly - especially question3. I'll go back and have another look at these when I can get access to the PC I installed the trial version on. I think in order to understand the articles fully, I need to do more work on the trial version. Then if I still have questions, I will be able to explain myself more clearly.

@Jane - thank you for the information on the plugins for TNG - I didn't know about these, and it may be that my questions about file structure will become irrelevant.

Thank you both again for your help.
Sharon

[tatewise]

Sharon, it is unlikely that the Project structure would prevent you from continuing with your current techniques.

If you could describe you current folder & file hierarchy in more detail, and why you think the Project structure might not support it, then we can give more precise advice.

Many users are initially concerned about the folder hierarchy they have evolved for managing Multimedia files, with perhaps different sub-folders for Certificates, Census Records, Photographs, etc, etc.
This hierarchy can be retained unchanged if absolutely necessary, but most users find that the same folder hierarchy can simply migrate into the Project structure Media folder.
When you create a V5 Project from your existing V3 data, that is exactly what FH will try to do if you just adhere to a few simple rules.
A major benefit of this V5 Project Media structure is that entire Projects can be backed-up, copied, moved, etc, without disrupting the GEDCOM Multimedia file links.

[Sharon]

Thanks tatewise.
The structure I currently have is :

file structure.JPG (13.1 KiB) Viewed 6467 times

The standard installation of FHv5 puts another layer between my gedcom and the media subfolders, by putting them into a Media folder.

fhv5 structure.JPG (14.99 KiB) Viewed 6467 times

The only options I can see for creating a new project is either to let FHv5 copy the media into the structure above, or to leave the media exactly where it is in its current structure. The latter option results in my media being on E: and the gedcom on C:. With either option, if I try and move the subfolders after the project has been created so that they are in the same folder as the gedcom - ie exactly match my current structure - I wil have to fix broken links and presumably would still lose the benefits of having a project.

It also looks as though I not only have to install FHv5 on C, but I have to keep all my data there as well. This could cause me serious space problems, and may mean I cannot upgrade while I am on this computer. (£36 wasted then!)

My understanding is that TNG requires the structure I currently have. However, the plugins for TNG referred to by Jane result in the converted media and gedcoms all being in the same folder, so I need to go back and recheck my understanding of TNG. I have no doubt that the plug-ins work with TNG, but I suspect I am going to need to do a lot of re-configuration of the way I currently have that software set up. Always assuming of course that I have the space to upgrade FH on C: in the first place, and at a cost of losing control over how and where I store my data in future.

Thank you again for your help.
Sharon

[tatewise]

As I said in reply to your question 2 above:

2. You can keep your data & media files on the E: drive (or any other drive) just as you do now.

FH does default to using \My Documents\Family Historian Projects\ on the C:\ drive, but you can change that (before importing your data) in the Project Window via the Location: link as described in how_to:v4:understanding_projects#project_structure|> Understanding Projects - Project Structure:

By default the master Family Historian Projects folder is created within the Windows My Documents folder, but any Location may be chosen from within the Project Window.

e.g. My projects are all in F:\Family History\Family Historian Projects\...

Yes, the Project structure inserts the Media folder so that its puts another layer between the GEDCOM and the media sub-folders. But since many FH users also use TNG I would be surprised if that is a problem. Perhaps Jane, or another TNG user, could explain how to deal with this scenario, and what needs changing after creating the Project in Sharon's case.

If you put your media files in the Family File 2012 public 2.fh_data folder instead of the Media folder, then most of the benefits of Projects still apply. The only exception will be that copying or moving a Project will break the Multimedia links and will need mending via Tools > Work with External File Links.

[Sharon]

tatewise - once again, thank you.

I am sorry I appear to be so dumb about this. I do keep reading the article, and yes, it says it can be done, but doesn't say how (at least not as far as I have been able to find). It has taken me a while to realise I had to click on the current location in order to reveal the option to change it. (My fault for assuming this was a hyperlink to take me to the current location. ). That is a great relief, as this would have ben a show stopper for me.

Re the plug-ins - I have no doubt that they work. It is most probable that my understanding of TNG is at fault. I had difficulties understanding how to set up the media links in TNG when I installed it last year, and did a lot of restructuring of my data for FH at the time, as I finally understand it to be required. Hence my concerns at changing it now. However the fact that the plug-ins result in everything in one folder, makes me think that I have overcomplicated matters somewhere along the line and will probably have to spend some time reconfiguring my media links within the TNG software.

It is at least reassuring to know that one option for me may be to move the media folders and fix the links, and still have access to the benefits of Projects. Now, once I get a better understanding of TNG's requirements for media, I will be able to choose whether to do that, or to go with the standard FHv5 setup, use the plug-ins and spend some time reconfiguring TNG.

Thank you again for your help.
Sharon

[Jane]

Sharon if you use the plugin it creates all the media in a folder called media and when you upload the gedcom and the media it works. The plugin could be changed to retain the folders if you wanted to, but I did not bother for me it's simpler just to have the one folder and any way I do not structure my subfolders in FH like TNG does preferring to structure Census and Certificates etc in separate folders.

If you want to do some tests. just set up another tree in TNG and upload your media and gedcom to that for testing.

You can see my simple implementation on my Taubman site.

[tatewise]

As far as I can tell, TNG imports your GEDCOM file and uses its Multimedia file links to import the linked Media files.

FH V5 Projects keep Media files in the Media folder and links to them using Relative file links.
In other words, the Multimedia Record file links only specify the sub-path within the Project Media folder.
It is this that allows Projects to be moved & copied without breaking the the Multimedia Record file links.
Thus a V5 Project GEDCOM will NOT import to TNG as it stands, and in any case TNG would not recognise Link to Face/Details Frames used in your FH Multimedia.

So to use TNG:

• The GEDCOM file must be exported from FH using File > Import/Export > Export > GEDCOM File with Full File Paths for File Links and any other options, such as to choose the export folder and protect privacy.
• Run the Convert File Links Plugin on this exported GEDCOM to make images TNG compatible and choose the folder to save the converted images.
• Run the Export Gedcom to TNG Plugin on this converted GEDCOM file to make GEDCOM file & tags TNG compatible.
• Upload the TNG compatible GEDCOM file to TNG.

[Sharon]

Thank you both for your replies.

I have spent the afternoon following the advice and instructions you have given and I think I have it sorted

I have successfully uploaded an exported / converted gedcom and all the associated data into TNG. I had to reset all the media links, but since my media names indicate which folder they belong to, this was easier than I thought.

I have also uploaded an updated version of the gedcom, with additonal media, to see how that works. TNG didn't recognise the new record's relationship to existing records when I just selected the new record for conversion, but it was fine when I converted the whole file again and uploaded it with just the new media.

Apologies for being so slow to grasp all this, and thank you both very much for the time you have spent helping me through it - it is very much appreciated.

Tomorrow I will do the upgrade for real on the computer I use for family history, confident that I'm going to be able to make it work

Regards,
Sharon