* Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio in AS
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- Gold
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Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio in AS
Hi, we've been having a discussion regarding recording repositories, author and publication information on the FH Forum Key Repositories? (14023). Acknowledging that the author, publication information and repository are not always known at the time of keying in on AS, where they are, it would be nice to be able to capture the data when creating the record and source in AS.
Can the input of author and publication information be included to compliment the repository link already in AS?
Would it also help if these fields were offered in the carry forward box when saving? So for example when entering a set of records from a parish register, the author, type, publisher and repository may remain the same. Similar applies to most census records.
thank you
Kevin
Can the input of author and publication information be included to compliment the repository link already in AS?
Would it also help if these fields were offered in the carry forward box when saving? So for example when entering a set of records from a parish register, the author, type, publisher and repository may remain the same. Similar applies to most census records.
thank you
Kevin
Kevin Merrison - bonkers for Bilbo* https://bilbow.one-name.net/
- NickWalker
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
The repository can already be captured when creating the record in AS (as you mention) and it does offer to retain the repository in the 'carry forward box' (Retain Data dialog). The reference ID can be automatically added to the Publication Information field in the source if the appropriate method 1 option has been selected and again this can be carried forward using the Retain Data dialog. So you could enter whatever you like into the reference and that would be recorded in the publication info. AS doesn't use Author.kevinmerrison wrote:Hi, we've been having a discussion regarding recording repositories, author and publication information on the FH Forum Key Repositories? (14023). Acknowledging that the author, publication information and repository are not always known at the time of keying in on AS, where they are, it would be nice to be able to capture the data when creating the record and source in AS.
Can the input of author and publication information be included to compliment the repository link already in AS?
Would it also help if these fields were offered in the carry forward box when saving? So for example when entering a set of records from a parish register, the author, type, publisher and repository may remain the same. Similar applies to most census records.
thank you
Kevin
It is a bit unfortunate that you requested this on the day I released a new version with no plans for another version in the immediate future. I can imagine a workaround would be to use a source title with a template that could put the Author and publication info in coded in some way (e.g. *PUB*: Whatever *Author*: whatever) and then you could create a plugin to look for any sources with titles including these coded values remove these values from the source title and fill them into the appropriate fields.
Cheers
Nick
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- Gold
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
Thank you Nick, that's great news regarding the repository as it eases my aim of better capturing the repository for the records. With the release done you probably deserve a break from requests! Maybe Author can be added for the next issue?
How do you/the group feel about automatically adding the author and repository for some of the censuses? As we now have a research:document_repository_guidelines|> Document Repository Guidelines (thanks Mike) could some of the census author and repository fields be auto-filled on AS. For example when selecting the UK 1841 Census on AS, author Home Office and repository The National Archive could be default settings. (Cannot think what else would want to be in there, but if it is a default that can be user switched-off/amened then it keeps everyone happy).
Maybe this would assist and/or encourage users to capture/think more about the source/author/repository of records?
Regards Kev
How do you/the group feel about automatically adding the author and repository for some of the censuses? As we now have a research:document_repository_guidelines|> Document Repository Guidelines (thanks Mike) could some of the census author and repository fields be auto-filled on AS. For example when selecting the UK 1841 Census on AS, author Home Office and repository The National Archive could be default settings. (Cannot think what else would want to be in there, but if it is a default that can be user switched-off/amened then it keeps everyone happy).
Maybe this would assist and/or encourage users to capture/think more about the source/author/repository of records?
Regards Kev
Kevin Merrison - bonkers for Bilbo* https://bilbow.one-name.net/
- LornaCraig
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
Kev, don't forget the UK includes Scotland, for which censuses have a different repository and (possibly, I'm not sure) a different author !when selecting the UK 1841 Census on AS, author Home Office and repository The National Archive could be default settings. (Cannot think what else would want to be in there.....
Lorna
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
Well Lorna, glad I asked. Of course Scotland is part of the UK and as you say the repository is the National Records of Scotland, New Register House and maybe under a different author to UK. So while the censuses were administered under the same act, undertaken on the same date using the same format, they did not end up in the same repository. So an auto entry for census repository for UK on AS would not be appropriate.
Thankfully we have the repository option in the carry forward box to assist.
Thankfully we have the repository option in the carry forward box to assist.
Kevin Merrison - bonkers for Bilbo* https://bilbow.one-name.net/
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
Of course, the source shouldn't be "UK census" but "England and Wales Census" or "Scotland Census" etc. as they're distinct document sets, so you could still have your auto-repository.... which I would turn off immediately (for all sorts of reasons I won't go into here but in summary: I use Elizabeth Shown Mills approach to citing sources and put all the information in the long title rather than break it up and still now have all the detail I want).
Helen Wright
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
Agreed. Currently AS lumps them together as 'UK' in the drop-down menu for Census country. So they would need to be separated for the auto-repository to work.
(BTW Kev, the Scottish 1911 census did not use quite the same format as the England and Wales one. It contained the same information, but did not use a separate page for each household. So you don't see the handwriting and signature of the head of household.)
(BTW Kev, the Scottish 1911 census did not use quite the same format as the England and Wales one. It contained the same information, but did not use a separate page for each household. So you don't see the handwriting and signature of the head of household.)
Lorna
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
The 1901 Census for Scotland, at least, was indeed taken under the same Act as the rest of the UK - "Census (Great Britain) Act 1900, 63 Vict. c.4. ". 1911 ditto - different Act, obviously (?).
The 1891 was a separate Act for Scotland - "Act for Taking the Census of Scotland (53 & 54 Vict c.38)", as were the 1861 thru 1881, while the 1841 and 1851 seem to have been the same Act across the UK. See http://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/research/g ... 841-census etc.
Not frightfully sure this matters, but now you know!
According to http://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/research/g ... us-records "The Scottish census has been the responsibility of the Registrar General for Scotland since 1861". So probably Home Office before?
The 1891 was a separate Act for Scotland - "Act for Taking the Census of Scotland (53 & 54 Vict c.38)", as were the 1861 thru 1881, while the 1841 and 1851 seem to have been the same Act across the UK. See http://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/research/g ... 841-census etc.
Not frightfully sure this matters, but now you know!
According to http://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/research/g ... us-records "The Scottish census has been the responsibility of the Registrar General for Scotland since 1861". So probably Home Office before?
Minor point, Lorna - my understanding is that both started with pretty much the same householder's schedule, but the Scottish 1911 ended up with the familiar enumerator's transcription (the householders' schedules being destroyed as usual), whereas the English & Welsh 1911 preserved the householders' schedules - I'm not sure if they were ever transcribed onto the familiar enumerator's transcription - there's a list of heads of household done by the enumerator in the FMP data but that's all I've seen.LornaCraig wrote:... the Scottish 1911 census did not use quite the same format as the England and Wales one. ...
Adrian
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
Thanks Adrian. Yes, I had wondered whether the 1911 Scottish census started with the same householder's schedule and then got transcribed. It's not easy to find out and it wasn't the most pressing claim on my time....
Regarding authorship, it looks as if Home Office is the best bet for 1841 and 1851, and Registrar General for Scotland from 1861 onwards. As I don't use the Author field for censuses it's not something I've looked into.
Regarding authorship, it looks as if Home Office is the best bet for 1841 and 1851, and Registrar General for Scotland from 1861 onwards. As I don't use the Author field for censuses it's not something I've looked into.
Lorna
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
I do - but I've only just realised that I used "General Register Office (England & Wales)" for all the years, including 1841 and 1851! Mind you - I'm not wholly convinced of the Home Office's role. I found some original instructions for the 1851 in Histpop.org and they seemed to be going out in the name of the Registrar General and being sent to the Superintendent Registrars. I only skimmed them, mind.LornaCraig wrote:... As I don't use the Author field for censuses it's not something I've looked into.
If the RG carried out the work, but then deposited it all at the Home Office, then TNA / PRO would have assigned it to the HO range. Does it matter? Probably not much in this case.
I have been known to contradict TNA's catalogue when creating my source-records in FH. (Shock, horror). Army documents, for instance, will get described by the name of the regiment not "War Office" or whatever department in the WO gets recorded in the TNA Catalogue. Really, it's whatever makes sense to you....
Adrian
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Re: Recording Source Author, Type & Publication Informatio i
I don't use UK as a country in AS. I have separate countries set up as England, Wales, Isle of Man, Scotland.
This enables me to better name the sources and display different Icons for each county. Also the Welsh 1891, 1901 & 1911 and the Isle of Man 1901 & 1911 census had an extra column for Language.
This enables me to better name the sources and display different Icons for each county. Also the Welsh 1891, 1901 & 1911 and the Isle of Man 1901 & 1911 census had an extra column for Language.